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Author Topic: DOPE  (Read 1173 times)

Offline Bryan Higgins

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DOPE
« on: April 16, 2008, 08:53:17 PM »
Hello Modelers

I was reading Model Aviation , an articale on Bill Werwage with his Valcan. 
He said he liked mixing his own colors with Auto Toners.  He'd use clear dope
and mix in his toner to make his color. Then he would thin and spray....

After he was done he would use catalized polyurethane for a clearcoat.

I know Toners are expensive.  But my question is:  Can i use my Urethane
Primer Surfacer  then apply Brodak Dope Paints then use my Urethane Clear
coat to finish. ???

I would like to use the Brodak Dope Products for trim coats if possible?.

Can i do it this way?. HB~> HB~> HB~>

                                                               Thanks  Bryan %^@

                                                                     



 
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2008, 11:27:58 PM »
Well Bryan,
simple answer, ,do a test panel, finish a test panel exactly like you propose to finish your plane, then you can answer your own question without risking your plane. My pat answer is no, dont mix product, dont mix paint types, dont mix thinners. However, you can get away with lots of stuff as proven by people with their magic systems. I personally dont see any advantage to using catalyzed primer,, then dope, then catalyzed clear. you are putting a product that will at best have marginal adhesion between two products that have great adhesion. I would say to use a standard base color system that is made for using with the primer and clear coats. It will reduce your risk of problems, and enhance the overall finish of your labored over model.
Ask Randy Powell, hes tried just about every combination out there I think,, and he is very willing to share his escapades and nightmares.
bottom line, if you want to go off the safe path, do a test panel exactly like you will do your plane, then you can be about 85 percent sure you know how it will react
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2008, 09:51:25 AM »
Hi Brian,

That is combination my cheap self has not tried.  I don't have any catalyzed primer!  I have used several Automotive Urethane clears over dope and it works just fine as several others have also done.  Sparky does it, also.  You can use butyrate dope to repair over the catalyzed clears, but not over the base coat automotive colors.

Since I cannot say about your primer, do as Mark says and do a test panel!
Bill <><
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Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2008, 04:30:52 PM »
Thanks Mark,Bill & Ty

I am just running low on cash after building my shop and setting up my paint area.
Wanted to know if i could substitute a cheaper paint for painting a 3/16 stripe over
basecoat for trimming than spend another $35.00 dollars for a half pint.

I guess it just takes time to build up a colosal house of colors for the cabinet.

I am using Xtreme Original Clearcoat 4.1 product by Five Star $42.67 Gal.
And the Xtreme Hardner4.1 Fast $23.33 Qt.
For a total of $66.00

The Colors are whats killing me. I guess i need to calm down and just do a simpler
color scheme. The Brodak Dope in 16oz. cans looks mighty welcome at $9.99
Bryan R higgins Jr.
Arvada,Colorado
AMA#885188

Offline Randy Powell

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2008, 07:31:05 PM »
I've used catalyzed primer then dope colors then catalyzed urethane for top coat without problems. but repair can be tough.

I just got a pint of black toner from the auto store this week. $12. And the difference with what happened to Ty is, I got a pint of black toner. Difference is likely that with Ty, he was buying something that could have had as much as 25 components in it. For me, there was one. I was going to get a mix pint (like Ty, they mix it up just like they were going to do the whole thing but leave out the clear (urethane) binder) of Lamborghini metallic yellow. It is the sweetest darkish metallic color you've ever seen. Price: $175. I must have blanched when he told me that. My paint guy says, uh, you sure you want that. Uh, no, thanks. I think I'll buy groceries for the week instead. And a tank of gas. Sheesh! Oh well, the yellow I ended up mixing up myself worked pretty well.
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #5 on: April 21, 2008, 02:20:14 PM »
Make freinds with a small (preferably one man) body shop, they always have leftobers from jobs they do, of course it will be full on base clear instead of being like Randy uses adding dope clear. but iin most cases shops have to pay to get rid of leftover paint because of hazmat fees.
and the amount you use, you only need a touch anyway, its worth a shot, but just try to stay with one shop so you dont mix brands.
For years the rat race had me going around in circles, Now I do it for fun!
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Offline Bryan Higgins

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2008, 02:40:56 PM »
Thanks Guy's

  I guess i will try some toners later .  Sounds like the way to go as long as you don't order
Farrari Red.

  $12 to $20 a pint is not bad for custom toners.  And you get to experiment with colors.
 
 I seen a color last week i really liked. It was at terrysautopaint.com the color was called
Nuclear Yellow by Alsa 1 pint $41.95 
 It was a metallic yellow that would look great with Burnt Oranges , Reds and Blues.
Basically all the Alsa Stylin Basecoats look good.  They have some stuff called Candy
Concentrates i like to try out.  I'm almost ready to paint.  I will post photos!   Bryan
Bryan R higgins Jr.
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2008, 10:22:58 PM »
Bryan,

One of the cool thing about using auto toners is, your driving down the street and see some wicked color you like. All you have to do is first identify the make, model and year of the car (at least close on the year) and look up the color number on www.autocolorlibrary.com . Get the color number and go to your local paint guy and say here the color number. Mix it without clear binder (being careful of metallics or pearls that are liquid additives). He mixes it up sans clear binder. You take it home and pour in clear dope and Viola! instant paint that you wanted. As long as you don't go with exotic colors (like the Lamborghini color I was looking at), it works out pretty well. And I've added dry pearls and such to such paint that can make for some very cool colors.
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Offline dave shirley jr

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2008, 10:53:56 PM »
hey Randy
didn't you try the waterbase colors?
how did they workout?
they seem fairly inexspensive for small amounts
Dave.

Offline Randy Powell

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2008, 10:03:16 AM »
Dave,

They work really well. Nice thing is, they are inert once dry. You can paint them over anything and anything can over them. There are some tricks to it (several, in fact), but they are not very hard to use. Mike Haverly did his ill-fated Freedom 45 with Auto Air Colors. Worked out nicely.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2008, 08:20:49 AM by Randy Powell »
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: DOPE
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2008, 07:13:53 PM »
Thanks Guy's

  I guess i will try some toners later .  Sounds like the way to go as long as you don't order
Farrari Red.

  $12 to $20 a pint is not bad for custom toners.  And you get to experiment with colors.
 
 I seen a color last week i really liked. It was at terrysautopaint.com the color was called
Nuclear Yellow by Alsa 1 pint $41.95 
 It was a metallic yellow that would look great with Burnt Oranges , Reds and Blues.
Basically all the Alsa Stylin Basecoats look good.  They have some stuff called Candy
Concentrates i like to try out.  I'm almost ready to paint.  I will post photos!   Bryan

Hi Brian,

I found a nice, bright red that was the least expensive red available (for some reason!).  it is KIA Blaze Red.  maybe everything about the KIA is inexpensive? LL~  But it's a nice red!

Bill <><
Big Bear <><

Aberdeen, NC

James Hylton Motorsports/NASCAR/ARCA

AMA 95351 (got one of my old numbers back! ;D )

Trying to get by


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