Author Topic: Building a new nose section (Read 2004 times)

James Mills · « **on:** December 19, 2010, 07:47:00 AM »

Question for some of you expert builders, how would you go about adding a new nose section to a finished plane?

Thanks,

James

Leester · « **Reply #1 on:** December 19, 2010, 07:56:26 AM »

I'm not an expert by any means but more info please. Profile ? Built up ? some pictures would be great to see what's left.

James Mills · « **Reply #2 on:** December 19, 2010, 11:04:20 AM »

Quote from: Leester on December 19, 2010, 07:56:26 AM

I'm not an expert by any means but more info please. Profile ? Built up ? some pictures would be great to see what's left.

Sorry, it's a built up fuse and is still in one piece, just wishing I would have built the nose a bit different. My computer died Friday so I can't post any pictures (they are all on the old one and we have to get the data recovered, lucky we have a family member who will be able to help us with that). The plane is my Formula S, should be a picture posted in the classic section.

James

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #3 on:** December 19, 2010, 06:45:54 PM »

here is the photo of the plane in question.

I am a little confused as to what your wanting to do - the nose looks fine.

However - I can give you a little advice on how ive rebuilt models in the past that have crashed.

You want to create an internal wall for the exterior of the fuse to sit on, so you are buildin in essence a new internal side wall that will allow you to join old piece and new piece together. If you try to butt join it without this internal wall it will prove difficult.

build it up as per normal - make the adjustments as required for the modified nose - redoing the cowl, canopy ect.. Sand back 2 inchs into the old paintwork, reprime, re fill go through your normal finishing process and be careful when you clear that you only spray the parts that have been sanded.

Without more information as to what was wrong with the 1st fuse I cant give any more help. If you want to make it stronger you can carbon laminate the internal walls with 1 extra firewall, if you want to make it 1/2 longer just add it to the front and reapply the finish.

Whats wrong with it?

Bill Little · « **Reply #4 on:** December 19, 2010, 09:04:04 PM »

H James,

Like PJ asked: "What's wrong with it?"

(I learned early on in life, "Don't fix it if it ain't broke".

)

James Mills · « **Reply #5 on:** December 19, 2010, 10:03:23 PM »

PJ and Bill,

I originally built the plane around a VF40 (it's what I had at the time) and after talking with Randy Smith about the potential balance problems I changed the mount set up to use Windy's squash mounts and put in a 36. The plane seems to fly well enough but I worry about the motor with this mount system. It flies very well so I am a bit leery of "poking the bear" as the saying goes.

Thanks,

James

Bill Little · « **Reply #6 on:** December 19, 2010, 10:13:30 PM »

Hi James,

I have seen many people use the mount system you are talking about, don't know of any particular problems.

Just curious.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #7 on:** December 21, 2010, 08:39:38 AM »

James, why try to fix something that isn't broke. If you are using what I think you are, no problem. You are afraid of the engine moving under the clamps, right? If so, mark your engine where you want it. You only need to drill two holes just deep enough in the motor mounts to put a couple of metal pins in. The pins are usually cut off machine screws. glue them ino the mounts and let cure. Put your engine back in the plane with the clamps. This will save having to rebuild the nose of a gorgeous plane. Remember I seen it in person.

PJ Rowland · « **Reply #8 on:** January 28, 2011, 08:24:12 PM »

I was under the impression it was due to a crash, not a nose Modification. Fly it till it breaks I say. Start building a new one in the meantime and make the new changes as per your requirements.

Tim Wescott · « **Reply #9 on:** January 28, 2011, 09:08:24 PM »

Quote from: James Mills on December 19, 2010, 07:47:00 AM

Question for some of you expert builders, how would you go about adding a new nose section to a finished plane?

Cut everything that needs to get cut, then glue everything that needs to get glued? (sorry, couldn't resist -- I can visualize this easily, but it's hard to put into words).

It kind of depends on what you're modifying, and how you want to proceed. You could whack off the offending part, then build the new section on piece by piece -- this gives you the best chance of making each individual wood-wood joint strong and tight. You could make a new nose section then try to graft it on -- this almost guarantees you a mismatch someplace. If it's a traditional stunt construction with engine bearers, and if you're not going to need them to be significantly wider, then leave them in and restyle the wood around them -- you'll retain a lot of strength and straightness that way. Even if you need to move them, try to do so by splicing them in place then whacking off any excess.

Whatever you do is going to be heavier, weaker, or both -- it's been suggested that you fly the thing into the ground, and that may not be a bad idea. Start on the replacement, and fly this one out or gift it to some kid who needs a ride, or whatever.

Bill Little · « **Reply #10 on:** January 28, 2011, 11:11:35 PM »

Quote from: Tim Wescott on January 28, 2011, 09:08:24 PM

Cut everything that needs to get cut, then glue everything that needs to get glued? (sorry, couldn't resist -- I can visualize this easily, but it's hard to put into words).

It kind of depends on what you're modifying, and how you want to proceed. You could whack off the offending part, then build the new section on piece by piece -- this gives you the best chance of making each individual wood-wood joint strong and tight. You could make a new nose section then try to graft it on -- this almost guarantees you a mismatch someplace. If it's a traditional stunt construction with engine bearers, and if you're not going to need them to be significantly wider, then leave them in and restyle the wood around them -- you'll retain a lot of strength and straightness that way. Even if you need to move them, try to do so by splicing them in place then whacking off any excess.

Whatever you do is going to be heavier, weaker, or both -- it's been suggested that you fly the thing into the ground, and that may not be a bad idea. Start on the replacement, and fly this one out or gift it to some kid who needs a ride, or whatever.

Hi Tim,

There is nothing physically wrong with the nose of James' plane. He just wanted to change it so that he wouldn't have to use the "clamp" style of engine mounts. Being a bit wary that the engine might move around. There are a ton of fixes for that, if the problem should arise, with out cutting the nose off and replacing it.

I think most of us responding agreed that the mounts shouldn't be a problem (Windy is credited with developing them for Brodak) and they have been used in numerous applications with out problems AFAIK. I hope we have "talked him out of it"!

Big Bear

James Mills · « **Reply #11 on:** January 29, 2011, 09:56:17 PM »

I hope we have "talked him out of it"!

Big Bear
[/quote]
Bill,

You guys have, I'm leaving well enough alone.

James

thomas farmer · « **Reply #12 on:** February 01, 2011, 07:09:07 PM »

James, You are building great looking models and I had the pleasure of personally seeing some of them. I would check mounts before each flying session for a while. I think you will be happy with the setup. Windy is great on setting up his models and testing his new Ideas, good luck, Tom Farmer

James Mills · « **Reply #13 on:** February 01, 2011, 08:21:46 PM »

Quote from: thomas farmer on February 01, 2011, 07:09:07 PM

James, You are building great looking models and I had the pleasure of personally seeing some of them. I would check mounts before each flying session for a while. I think you will be happy with the setup. Windy is great on setting up his models and testing his new Ideas, good luck, Tom Farmer

Tom,
Thanks, good to here from you. Ya'll need to head back up here (as soon as the open I-44

), we have areas that have up to 20" of snow you don't want to miss that

.

James

john e. holliday · « **Reply #14 on:** February 03, 2011, 10:34:47 AM »

I thought Tom was moving up to the area?

James Mills · « **Reply #15 on:** February 03, 2011, 06:24:17 PM »

Quote from: john e. holliday on February 03, 2011, 10:34:47 AM

I thought Tom was moving up to the area?

I think that is their plan but you'd have to ask Tom about the time table.

James

Author Topic: Building a new nose section (Read 2004 times)

James Mills

Building a new nose section

Leester

Re: Building a new nose section

James Mills

Re: Building a new nose section

PJ Rowland

Re: Building a new nose section

Bill Little

Re: Building a new nose section

James Mills

Re: Building a new nose section

Bill Little

Re: Building a new nose section

john e. holliday

Re: Building a new nose section

PJ Rowland

Re: Building a new nose section

Tim Wescott

Re: Building a new nose section

Bill Little

Re: Building a new nose section

James Mills

Re: Building a new nose section

thomas farmer

Re: Building a new nose section

James Mills

Re: Building a new nose section

john e. holliday

Re: Building a new nose section

James Mills

Re: Building a new nose section