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Building Tips and technical articles. => Building techniques => Topic started by: Steve Thornton on June 09, 2011, 01:42:50 PM
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Thank you guys for the help-I have found many answers to questions here. Here is one for opinions, techniques, and experience. Should I cover a profile plane with Monokote before attaching the rudder and stab or Monokote the tail feathers before attaching them to the fuselage? My Skyray 35 will look like a Porsche with mud tires before I get finished, but I have enjoyed getting back into building and my mistakes are for learning. Thanks for the help.
Steve Thornton
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cover all major assemblies - jig and align and mark out where the fuse goes on the main wing ans stab - remove the monocote from the joint area - glue and re-jig. DONE!
It is a LOT easier doing the 'cote first - trying to put film on a built model is a PITA
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Absolutely do what Wynn says....you'll hate yourself otherwise. Don't ask how I know this! LOL H^^
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Thank you for the help gentlemen. Now if you don't mind, explain how you jig the rudder Wynne. I have the stab jigged okay, but still trying to figure a way to get a vertical stab to be vertical.
Steve
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Use a piece of card board to make a 90 degree triangle. Cut the inner corner off to allow for the fuselage interference. Use the triangle to align the fin 90 degrees to the stab and after gluing it to the fuselage, run masking tape from the tip of the fin to the tip of the stab (both sides). This will hold the fin in alignment without having to use straight pins, which will puncture the covering. You can lift and re-stick the tape until the fin is perfectly aligned, then let the glue set for a day or so.
Paul
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Absolutely do what Wynn says....you'll hate yourself otherwise. Don't ask how I know this! LOL H^^
As an alternative, get the wing glued into the fuselage, make nice fillets, paint the fuselage and the first inch or so of wing, then Monocoat the wings. You should still finish the tail first, unless they're sheet and you paint them with the fuselage.
Whatever you do, make a firm decision and stick with it. And when you do get around to gluing in the wing and tail, use slow glue so you can double and triple check everything before it starts to set -- nothing sucks worse than getting everything glued together with CA then realizing it's out of whack, although trying to rip apart a plane that's held together with half-cured five-minute epoxy comes close.
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Do like advised, at least till you get really experienced with films. I now assemble first and cover afterwards as there are some things that are impossible to achieve by covering first, especialy on a full fuse model. The attached is all monokote.
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Peter that's incredible! I am really struggling with the basics but like everything else I have done, persistent practice will eventually pay off. I have started over many times on the stab, elev, etc. and find that after a couple of months I still don't have a plane that I can fly. I am considering buying an ARF just to get into the air while my building moves out of the clumsy stage. Thanks for all the great input.
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Peter that's incredible! I am really struggling with the basics but like everything else I have done, persistent practice will eventually pay off. I have started over many times on the stab, elev, etc. and find that after a couple of months I still don't have a plane that I can fly. I am considering buying an ARF just to get into the air while my building moves out of the clumsy stage. Thanks for all the great input.
Steve, check this out here I am covering a Magnum.
http://www.builtrightflyright.com/MiscHelpPgs/magnum/projects/MagnumBld5.htm
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Peter that's incredible! I am really struggling with the basics but like everything else I have done, persistent practice will eventually pay off. I have started over many times on the stab, elev, etc. and find that after a couple of months I still don't have a plane that I can fly. I am considering buying an ARF just to get into the air while my building moves out of the clumsy stage. Thanks for all the great input.
If you haven't flown much, go ahead and fly the model 'ugly'. If you're going to prang it anyway, it won't stay pretty long.
(and laugh at me -- I'm still crashing regularly, yet I'm rebuilding a gift plane so it'll be pretty.)
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Planes can be made pretty with out all the work of a twenty point finish. Just make the judges stand further away. H^^
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The way I finish they would have to be in the next county. Or better yet maybe blind judges, then my terrible pattern would kill my score.
Steve
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Proparc
Suggestion that has really helped me with film finishes. Contact some guys at a local rc club. Have them put you in touch with one of the clubs really good builders who does really good film coating. Then go learn from him and pick his brain. Always be nice to him cause you are gonna need to come back time and again. Most are not really good at it in most clubs and with the beautiful arf's you can get you'll need to find someone who is a builder and continues to build. That last part is pretty important cause the materials change. Monocote is not the same material it used to be. If you try to use it they way it used to be used it will disappoint. Ultracote is a completely different acting material in its subtleties. It will take a while but you will be able to learn it if you find someone who is good at it. Just as with paint though it takes patience.... and lots of it. But then whose first 10 doped planes were 20 point planes.... well, I know there's Windy, but I mean normal humans.
bob branch
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Bob has good suggestions. There is a caveat with RC guys though. Most of the RC covering jobs these days are over balsa skinned foam wings. These are orders of magnitude easier to cover than open bay structures as is common in CL. Doing a good covering with film requires a degree of physicality. To do a proper job you have to get intimate with the airplane very much like when you are sanding the airframe. You can not just stick it in a painting stand and cover. For most of my covering tasks the model is in my lap and I and I am heating and stretching and sticking.
If you are covering in film and you don't have the feeling that you can use a pair of extra arms you are not doing it right. Because of the physicality required to get a top notch covering job in film, it is easy to accidentally iron in a warp on open bay ribbed wings. This is where experience in film coverings helps a lot. Nice thing is that a warp is equally easy to remove but could turn out to be a exercise in frustration.
Mistakes are far harder to correct. Cut something the wrong size or shape you can not just do a touch up spray job, the entire panel has to be removed and you start from scratch.
It is a myth that getting a great finish with film is easy and any dunce with a clothes iron can do it as some individuals would lead you to believe. While it is not as time consuming to get it covered to a given color than with paint. To get a outstanding finish and graphics scheme done in film is far harder. What would be your masking in a paint process is your actual covering, and unlike masking it has to stay on and add as little weight as possible. Like I said before any mistake and the entire panel has to be removed and replaced. Once it's down it is down. you can't sand away seams or irregular lines, it has to be as perfect as you can make it the first time.
On rule of thumb is be prepared to waste a ton of material. You can not achieve results being frugal or stingy with the covering. Trying to do so makes things a whole order of magnitude more difficult. Allow a full 2 or 3 inches excess covering for any surface. You need something to grab onto and manipulate. In certain areas I'll give up to 4 inches of excess.
This is not going to be cheap but then neither is a top notch paint finish.
If you keep an eye on the Pathfinder LE build thread in the building techniques section. I'll be giving a step by step film finishing tutorial on the plane. I'll just have to figure out how to snap photos while I have my 4 hands full with the iron, monokote and model.
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Peter
Hint for photos.... pull film with your teeth. Worked for me on the T-Rex build thread where I showed an ultracote finish. Its in the electric forum.
bob
n~
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Folks should copy Peter's post, frame it, and hang it over the wotkbench. All but the simplest covering jobs require extreem attention. Even the simple one color jobs will benifit from the advice Peter has offered.