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Author Topic: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!  (Read 35385 times)

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #50 on: April 15, 2012, 08:22:34 AM »
This isn't just a build Thread, this is the "Instruction Manual." Lot easier than putting a paper manual together, plus you save on printing. Which BTW, the customer pays for.

To some, I'm sure this Build is "over-detailed," but, you must remember, there are some modelers that haven't had the experience others have had. The Build is really for the benifit of these modelers. Plus the Build offers a place to "review," if someone elects to build The New American.


OK! Lets see what ten more minutes got me.

I "V" sanded the elevator, hinge side obviously, to 45 degrees. No jigs, no welded angle iron or aluminum bent thingies or clamps holding whatever.

Just a simple plastic angle propped up with, just about anything to hold it. Stickyback sandpaper and away you go.

Sand some, take a peek, sand a bit more, look again. Not rocket science.

Trailing edge taper? I just prop the leading edge up a bit using whatever thickness material I need. In this case, I made good use of the fuselage side to the Twin Boom Ares, which I currently have on hold. Cute step on the fuselage side held the elevator nice nice as I slid it on the sandpaper. You can taper the TE to a sharp edge this way if you choose.

LE of the Stab, simply eyeballed a radius. Some finish sanding when both pieces are attached.

Tight fit and plenty of movement! The elevator will deflect more that what you see. Enough to get you in trouble.

Never blow sawdust away, always vacuum.

Well, only ten minutes of building and these pieces can be placed aside.

Still waiting on nitrate dope for silk covering. Or will I go with tissue?

The cliffhanger.

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #51 on: April 16, 2012, 05:23:51 PM »
It's spackling time!

Well not really, but I did a bit anyway. I generally like to give my bare wood a coat of Dr. Good before I apply any spackling or fillers.

The entire wing will receive a slight amount of board sanding, nothing drastic, remember, it's a kick around sport stunt model.

Also, you can see I placed or added radius material, balsa actually, in the corners. Looks nice and also makes the appearance that you can build.   n~

Charles

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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #52 on: April 16, 2012, 07:18:38 PM »
I know I'm getting close to covering and final assembly when I bring out the Dr. Good.

Here's one coat after a quick rub n buff with P150.

I'll do the other half of these parts tomorrow. I can then apply a bit more spackling, in other less obvious areas, without taking down the wood.

Charles  
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #53 on: April 17, 2012, 10:29:24 AM »
Just think. The New American, started out as an idea!

Getting there!

Charles
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #54 on: April 17, 2012, 12:18:36 PM »
Still looking good.   Myself I run the grain in corner gussets of the wing sheeting at 45 degrees.   The corner gussets do make for a nicer covering job.   Without them I always got little wrinkles in the corners. H^^
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #55 on: April 17, 2012, 12:30:47 PM »
Still looking good.   Myself I run the grain in corner gussets of the wing sheeting at 45 degrees.   The corner gussets do make for a nicer covering job.   Without them I always got little wrinkles in the corners. H^^

John,

Thanks for the input, I appreciate it.

Are your wrinkles from "iron on" material?

I've never had a wrinkle using dope with silk or tissue.

I was going to use silk because I actually have some, but I can save some time using tissue.

Which one are you more fond of?

Charles
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #56 on: April 17, 2012, 01:12:06 PM »
Go with the silk for the open bays.  Less chance of accidental punctures.

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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #57 on: April 17, 2012, 01:25:44 PM »
Go with the silk for the open bays.  Less chance of accidental punctures.BIG BearRNMM/AMM

OK Bill,

You made my mind up for me, silk it is.

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #58 on: April 17, 2012, 01:31:35 PM »
Back to that top block.

Bit more sanding then removal to hollow. I have a great tool made for hollowing and I'll Post the underside photo.

I'll use this Sig clear canopy which, obviously, needs to be trimmed a bit, well trimmed a lot! I wanted a wide canopy which is why I chose this size Sig canopy. Trimming is no big deal, Plus, if I make a mistake in trimming, my local HS has more!

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #59 on: April 17, 2012, 07:19:58 PM »
Hollow blocks? Or it just goes to show you, never throw anything out?

Underside carely shows left over unused stock from an old Sig Astro Hog kit. One less thing to buy.   ;D

Anyone ever whittle as a kid?

Charles
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #60 on: April 18, 2012, 08:19:27 AM »
Invariably I will get a wrinkle or two in  the corners.  It happens with silk, nylon, silkspan, Monokote and even SLC. H^^
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #61 on: April 18, 2012, 08:52:10 AM »
Invariably I will get a wrinkle or two in  the corners.  It happens with silk, nylon, silkspan, Monokote and even SLC. H^^

John,

If this wrinkle issue happens with every model you cover and you can live with it, fine.

My guess, you're doing something to cause this. I would do some reviewing on methods that modelers use to apply coverings.

I haven't applied silk in over 49 years, and I won't have one single wrinkle.

You may want to get to the bottom of it.

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #62 on: April 25, 2012, 06:45:54 PM »
Ordered my nitrate and butyrate dope today, along with thinner.

Ordering silk is next.

Getting there!

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #63 on: April 27, 2012, 10:05:20 AM »
Ordered silk this morning for The New American, The International, and the Twin Boom.

I think I'll have a contest to "Name" the Twin Boom model.

I'll explain in detail, exactly what the Twin Boom is and the rules, soon.

Charles
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Offline Randy Powell

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #64 on: April 27, 2012, 06:49:01 PM »
Well, it seems you're having fun. That's good.
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #65 on: April 27, 2012, 07:42:52 PM »
Well, it seems you're having fun. That's good.

Randy,

Thanks, I am having fun.  n~

I haven't built a CL model in 49 years or so and it does feel good. Especially that The New American, as simple and basic a model as it is, was my one design.

Not a lot of interest in it. possibly when it's finished and painted. That makes a big difference.

While I've been waiting for the dope to arrive, I've been working on that 50 year old modified Ares wing.

I did Post some info and photos about this wing, and I decided to continue with it.

I'll use this wing on The International, another design I mentioned a while back. I'm almost satisfied with the fuselage design, not a straight line anywhere. This one is a cutie. Wheel pants and all.

Thanks again for the reply.

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #66 on: April 28, 2012, 08:51:46 AM »
Last chance to guess the weight of The New American framed parts.

MIDNIGHT TONIGHT!

The Witching hour.

Good luck!

Charles
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #67 on: April 30, 2012, 09:15:42 PM »
So who won the guess the weight contest and what is the weight?
Crist
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Offline Mark Scarborough

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #68 on: April 30, 2012, 09:18:49 PM »
I was wondering that too, it appears that the thread owner must have deleted it somwhere along the line
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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #69 on: May 02, 2012, 09:37:51 PM »
Yeah, it looks like it.  He has visited this site this evening, so we know he's "home".  Wonder what's going on.
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #70 on: May 03, 2012, 03:30:10 PM »
The total weight of everything in the photo was 41 oz.

Ty Marcucci was the winner.

His graphics went in the mail today.

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #71 on: May 03, 2012, 03:42:18 PM »
Back on topic.

I've applied three coats of nitrate dope to the surface of the wing. I'm told to NOT use nitrate, ever!

I'll take that advice because nitrate dries rapidly in this Florida heat AND it came from a good source. More than one actually.

My next model, most likely the twin boom or The International, will have no nitrate applied, just Butyrate.

The New American's fuselage is now glued to the wing, with no offset.

The linkage gave me a bit of difficulty, because I attempted to use some old R/C Dave Brown pushrods, but I got through it.

the Dave Brown pushrods are light and nice but the size doesn't adapt itself to Tom Morris' HDWE.

Did finally find a way to hook up TM HDWE.

I've seen worst applications.  n~

Only adjustment is at the elevator.

Done, I'm living with it.

Charles

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Offline Crist Rigotti

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #72 on: May 03, 2012, 05:57:55 PM »
Thank you Charles for having this contest.   You are very generous.
Crist
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #73 on: May 05, 2012, 12:01:12 PM »
Thank you Charles for having this contest.   You are very generous.

Crist,

Unexpected but, thank you for that.

Charles
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If you're Trolled, you know you're doing something right.  Alpha Mike Foxtrot. "No one has ever made a difference by being like everyone else."  Marcus Cordeiro, The "Mark of Excellence," you will not be forgotten. "No amount of evidence will ever persuade an idiot."- Mark Twain. I look at the Forum as a place to contribute and make friends, some view it as a Realm where they could be King.   Proverb 11.9  "With his mouth the Godless destroys his neighbor..."  "Perhaps the greatest challenge in modeling is to build a competitive control line stunter that looks like a real airplane." David McCellan, 1980.

Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #74 on: May 05, 2012, 12:09:39 PM »
Few more things happening, gotta build weight someplace.  ;D

Fitted and glued the turtle deck sheeting. Sheeting gets sanded at both ends and sanded to blend into the fuselage sides.

Rear tail filler blocks in place, these are lowers, there's two uppers. All act to stiffen the tail area.

Nose blocks racked and stacked waiting for sanding.

Tank area where there will be a removable tank hatch. Thinking about that construction.

F1 shows surface cut marks where I was going to remove the top half of F1 to have a slide in tank.

Rethinking that for a tank hatch.

Charles

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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #75 on: May 09, 2012, 07:11:51 PM »
Well, in spite of all the craziness happening in the household the last couple of days, PC crash and all, I did manage to find time for The New American. I worked on the International's wing also. hard to pull myself away from that model because it's much more interesting.

Anyway, I glued the upper engine surround blocks in place and contoured the nose a bit. Still have a ways to go.

You can see trim lines to allow for a clean fit of the NIB OS LA .40 Blue! Cutting that away will allow for the engine to sit back where it belongs.

Thinking about that tank hatch.

OS LA .40 looks big for the model?   n~

Charles
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Offline Avaiojet

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #76 on: May 10, 2012, 09:35:07 AM »
Well, dead in the water until I get a tongue muffler, and more trimming will be required then.

Engine is placed exactly where it bolts in.

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #77 on: May 10, 2012, 03:00:29 PM »
Stab is now permanently glued, (CA'd) in position actually. Elevator will be removed for covering.

Wire skid can be seen in place, is simply sandwiched between two pieces of thin ply. A change from the original plywood skid. It was suggested I go with a length of wire. Thanks for that suggestion.

.125" soft balsa will be used to sheet the underbelly of the fuselage. Edge will get rounded.

Getting there!

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #78 on: May 12, 2012, 12:08:27 PM »
Bottom sheeting, no rocket science there.

Tank botton and tank area and tank hatch.

Tank hatch, good, bad or indifferent it's done. Now to decide how to secure it? Rubber bands?

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #79 on: May 28, 2012, 08:00:44 PM »
In spite of the fact I'm having issues with the use of clear dope, I'm still plugging away.

If my issues with clear dope can't be resolved, I'll build models with sheeted wings. That'll cure the dope issue!  ;D

Well here's my progress with the tail feathers silked. Worked out well on the elevator, but there's a repair on both sides of the stab, first hole near the fuselage. When completed this repair won't be visible. 20 hours of sanding later.  n~

Charles
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #80 on: May 29, 2012, 07:36:50 AM »
Are you spraying or brushing the clear dope?   I usually don't sand the first coat of clear.   Then it is only  to slightly knock down the rough edges.   Also are you putting it down thin enough?    Usually takes about 8 to 10 coats before it looks like I have any dope on the fabric I cover with.   Also as Sparky stated one  time,  "Only sand every other coat of clear dope".    H^^
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #81 on: May 29, 2012, 09:19:22 AM »
imagine that, my posts are dissapearing again
For years the rat race had me going around in circles, Now I do it for fun!
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Offline Jim Thomerson

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #82 on: May 29, 2012, 09:25:42 AM »
I use steel wool, rather than sandpaper, on open bay areas.

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #83 on: May 29, 2012, 09:51:48 AM »
imagine that, my posts are dissapearing again

Mark,

I all honesty, it has absolutely nothing to do with me.

You're welcome hear and so is your advice.

In fact, your advice is appreciated.

Just re-Post.

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #84 on: May 29, 2012, 10:03:23 AM »
Are you spraying or brushing the clear dope?   I usually don't sand the first coat of clear.   Then it is only  to slightly knock down the rough edges.   Also are you putting it down thin enough?    Usually takes about 8 to 10 coats before it looks like I have any dope on the fabric I cover with.   Also as Sparky stated one  time,  "Only sand every other coat of clear dope".    H^^

John,

Thanks for the reply.

I'm brushing butyrate now. I'm knocking it down a bit between coats using 360. Working on The International between coats.

I did have issues and had to replace a few small pieces of silk. I believe I have 6 or 7 coats on the elevator and 4 or so on the stab.

I'm applying it right out of the can on the elevator and thinning about 25% for the stab. One or two more coats and I'll be right out of the can with the stab. No retarder.

I'll knock all this down with hopes I don't cut an edge, then I'll spray a few coats. Knock it down some more.

I have no idea yet how I'll tackle the wing. I wish it was sheeted.

Thanks for the reply and interest,

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #85 on: May 30, 2012, 10:14:08 AM »
If you are using Brodak or even SIG clear (butyrate or nitrate), I am wondering how you  even get it to brush.   I usually transfer the dope to mason jar and thin at least 50% before I use it.   I have even had to thin it even more on some cans.   The preceding is for brushing. H^^
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #86 on: May 30, 2012, 10:20:55 AM »
John,

That was my issue. Dope doesn't respond like paint at all. I'm using Randolf dope and I'm thinning it.

Brushing? No, I'm laying it on with one stroke with a fully charged brush. You can't brush, the stuff sets up to quickly.

I have no idea why color dope is even used? It's not fuel proof and has to be cleared with something that IS fuelproof.

I wonder?

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #87 on: June 02, 2012, 09:16:12 AM »
Well it's canopy time!

Never did one quite this way. My pattern ships had painted canopies and my scale models I'd sometimes  make a frame.

Suggestions on this install application were generously given up by some great model builders. 

Thanks to all those modelers who offered and shared! As you can see, I took your advice!

I'll probably scratch the entire canopy and clear it along with the model, that's been going on for years.

I'm still rethinking color dope. Seems pointless to use the stuff because it's not fuel proof and has to be cleared.

My base coat clear coat experience is all I know. Worked extremely well for a good number of years, so why change a winning game?

Charles

 

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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #88 on: June 02, 2012, 09:29:01 AM »
Still looking good.  H^^
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #89 on: June 02, 2012, 04:44:55 PM »
HI Charles,

Colored Butyrate is as "fuel proof" as the clear Butyrate.  Nitrate, however, is not "hot fuel proof" in colors or clear.

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #90 on: June 02, 2012, 05:10:51 PM »
HI Charles,Colored Butyrate is as "fuel proof" as the clear Butyrate.  Nitrate, however, is not "hot fuel proof" in colors or clear.BIG BearRNMM/AMM

Bill,

My Mentor, where have you been?

OK, understandable with the Butyrate colors being fuel proof.

But are they as fuel proof as two part automotive clears? No point in naming a brand.

What say on that?

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #91 on: June 03, 2012, 06:31:43 AM »
Bill,

My Mentor, where have you been?

OK, understandable with the Butyrate colors being fuel proof.

But are they as fuel proof as two part automotive clears? No point in naming a brand.

What say on that?

Charles

Hi Charles,

The automotive urethane clear is much more hot fuel resistant than any of the "lacquer types".  (Dope is a "lacquer type")  As you know, epoxy paint is the most resistant.  I wish Hobbypoxy was still around.

Bill
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Offline Brett Buck

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #92 on: June 03, 2012, 03:09:21 PM »
Hi Charles,

The automotive urethane clear is much more hot fuel resistant than any of the "lacquer types".  (Dope is a "lacquer type")  As you know, epoxy paint is the most resistant.  I wish Hobbypoxy was still around.



   KlassKote is still around and it's essentially identical to Hobbypoxy.

     Brett

Offline Serge_Krauss

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #93 on: June 03, 2012, 10:06:56 PM »
I always thought Hobbypoxy was fuel proof, but I got out a model I painted with Hobbypoxy red back in 1970 and discovered in late 2010 that rubbing alcohol softened the finish. That was disappointing.

SK

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #94 on: June 03, 2012, 10:17:58 PM »
I always thought Hobbypoxy was fuel proof, but I got out a model I painted with Hobbypoxy red back in 1970 and discovered in late 2010 that rubbing alcohol softened the finish. That was disappointing.

Maybe it ages?  Or could you have possibly been less talented at following directions in 1970, and have mixed it incorrectly?
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The problem with electric is that once you get the smoke generator and sound system installed, the plane is too heavy.

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #95 on: June 04, 2012, 09:18:41 AM »
Maybe it wasn't Hobbypoxy?

1970!

I'd have a difficult time rembering where I put the model.   n~

Charles
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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #96 on: June 12, 2012, 01:38:33 PM »
Well,

Chipping away trying to progress with The New American.

Purchased a great tongue muffler and NVA for the OS LA 40 Blue which will power this model. Now I can trim the muffler area at the nose and get that done.

I used Polyspan/Polyester Tissue for the first open area as a test. Just followed the directions that came with the product.

I do like the stuff, but I believe I prefer using silk. I will use this material for the other bottom wing, however, I believe I'll use silk on the wing tops.

Photo shows wing bottom with applied Polyester Tissue. Same stuff as the BRAND Polyspan.

Taxing working the wingtip, stuff isn't all that forgiving, at least not like silk is.

Wingtip photo tells it all, small struggle there. Couple of coats of that liquid Gold, also known as clear Dope, and that fuzz will sand out smooth.

Plugging away.

Charles

Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
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Offline john e. holliday

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #97 on: June 13, 2012, 07:57:27 AM »
Stay with the same covering for both surfaces.   The silk may shrink a little tighter than the Poly will.   H^^
John E. "DOC" Holliday
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Offline Bill Little

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #98 on: June 13, 2012, 09:14:09 AM »
Stay with the same covering for both surfaces.   The silk may shrink a little tighter than the Poly will.   H^^

I agree Doc!  Switching covering from top to bottom of a wing panel is inviting warps.

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Re: "The NEW AMERICAN" Build Thread!
« Reply #99 on: June 13, 2012, 01:00:15 PM »
OK guys,

You made it clear.

As you can see, only one panel is covered with Polyspan. Do I remove the Polyspan and cover all four panels with silk, or do I continue with the polyspan on the other three?

Polyspan doesn't feel all that strong?

Charles
Trump Derangement Syndrome. TDS. 
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