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Author Topic: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest  (Read 308 times)

Offline wwwarbird

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Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« on: August 30, 2022, 07:55:22 PM »

 Is this contest still a thing?
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member

Offline wwwarbird

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2022, 09:36:05 PM »

 Hello? Anybody home?  ???
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member

Offline Jim Rhoades

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2022, 03:19:42 PM »
Warbird,

     I seem to remember reading something to the tune that it is no longer being flown.  Keith Trostle was probably the ring leader of the event and he left Tucson several years ago to Colorado.

Jim Rhoades

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2022, 09:02:05 PM »

 Thanks for the reply Jim. I was just wondering if they still have the event, it crossed my mind recently because I think it was usually in October which is coming up soon. I keep forgetting that Keith isn't in Tucson anymore, he was one of the more active guys down there and probably a major driving force for the event. Too bad they're not running it anymore, I always looked forward to the coverage and photos, it was a really neat event with some very interesting models.
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member

Online Trostle

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2022, 11:48:44 PM »
The 1/2A Multi-Engine Profile Scale Contest was the brain child of Mike Keville (former PAMPA President and founder of VSC).  Mike established the rules for two events - Limited for not throttles and Unlimited for throttled engines.  I do not have the rules in front of me right now, but extra points for more than two engines, extra points for more than one wing in both events.  Options could be used similar to the AMA Scale rules for the Unlimited class.  The event was initially held in Tucson for the first 4 or 5 years but had to be moved to Phoenix because the one Tucson circle for the shorter lines deteriorated so badly that the small airplanes could not be flown in Tucson.  The two other paved circles were donuts that were too small for most of the 1/2A scale models.  The flying site in Phoenix for several years was a parking lot for a large shopping center, but the shopping center management wanted to start charging an exorbitant amount to use the facility.  The event then just died.  The last event was probably seven years ago.

Members from the Tucson and Phoenix clubs helped organize these contests.  The contests were well managed and run.  The rules were adjusted as experience was gained.  At first, the rules gave extra points for each engine more than two.  This was changed early on to give bonus points if just more than two engines were used.  The profile definition was similar (I think) to the AMA rules definition for CL Profile Scale, basically maximum width for the fuselage of 1" and maximum for engine nacelles of 1.5".  Another sub category was added for the last two years to the Limited Class for the "Slab Award".  A perpetual trophy was set up for this.  The rules were that the entire construction could be no more than 1/4" sheet except for the engine nacelles.  A couple of "interesting" airplanes appeared for this category.  Airplanes could be proxy flown.  There are/were several "seasoned" pilots in the Tucson area that helped with the several airplanes that were shipped for the competition or when the builder was physically unable to fly his own airplane.

There were often several contestants from out of state that would attend.  Attendance was not huge and I think Mike was disappointed (as were several of us) that the event did not get more support.  The magazines at the time gave some coverage, particularly Flying Models, some passing photos in Model Aviation, I think Stunt News had a few articles, and the Brodak Control Line Flying magazine gave some coverage.  A surprising number and variety of airplanes appeared that had not been previously seen as models.

The St Louis Club has held 1/2 A multi-engine scale contest several times.  I am not familiar how often they have done so or what kind of participation they have had.

The Norvel engines with their functional throttle controls made the unlimited category a reality.  Several 4-engine airplanes appeared, several more 3-engine airplanes also appeared.  I know a B-36 was contemplated by one serious Tucson builder.  A Heinkel 111Z was also in the planning phase in Florida.  This has 5-engines which Ron Duly in California has had for a number of years.

I know that Mike Keville was disappointed (as were several of us) that more interest was not generated.  I think that with more time and if a good venue could have been consistently obtained and with support/coverage by the magazines, I think participation could have grown.  The proxy flying and the relative ease in shipping these smaller airplanes I think would make it attractive for more to try these models.  Unfortunately, when the event moved to Phoenix, it became more difficult to organize the event and participation did not warrant the work necessary to continue.

Electric power was not initially contemplated, but in the later years, there was some consideration to adopt rules to allow electrics, but this never went beyond the discussion stage.

Others might have more insight to this Tucson/Phoenix 1/2A multi-engine profile scale matter.

Keith

Offline wwwarbird

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2022, 10:24:37 PM »

 Thanks for the info Keith, pretty much explains everything. Sorry to see it gone. A good portion of the interest and entertainment value (for me) was that there were no electric models allowed. Anyone who can get multi-engine 1/2A models flying and performing well deserves all the credit for their efforts.
 
 On another note, when the Tucson contest was running I remember always thinking it would have been a great supporting category for the C/L NATS.  Relatively inexpensive and much less intimidating, especially for potential contestants with less building and flying experience. Probably way too late to consider it these days though, the AMA drone pushers wouldn't know what to do with something that might promote actual modeling.
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member

Online Trostle

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2022, 11:10:49 PM »
Thanks for the info Keith, pretty much explains everything. Sorry to see it gone. A good portion of the interest and entertainment value (for me) was that there were no electric models allowed. Anyone who can get multi-engine 1/2A models flying and performing well deserves all the credit for their efforts.
 
 On another note, when the Tucson contest was running I remember always thinking it would have been a great supporting category for the C/L NATS.  Relatively inexpensive and much less intimidating, especially for potential contestants with less building and flying experience. Probably way too late to consider it these days though, the AMA drone pushers wouldn't know what to do with something that might promote actual modeling.

Thanks for the interesting comments.  One of the rules for the Tucson 1/2A Multi-Engine Profile Scale contests was that each of the engines had to keep running for at least 10 laps.  I think it is both surprising and commendable that as far as I can remember, very very few of the entries failed this requirement.  I think that is a testament to the perseverance of the individual contestants and the ready assistance of all of those who attended.  There was a problem that many encountered with these little frustrating beasts.  The engines would run fine one at a time, but some experienced that the engines on these creatures seemed to talk to each other and did not like to do so.  Nevertheless, most of these things were successful and in my experience, most had an enjoyable time.  I attended everyone of these things.  There were others who did also.

You brought up an intriguing idea.  Why not run an unofficial event for these 1/2A Multi-Engine Profile Scale models at the Nats.  Might start with just the Limited category (no throttles) described earlier.  We might be able to find the few people it would need to pull it off.  A couple of judges, a person to ED the thing and a person to help with tabulation. 

On the other hand, this would not be that much different that the already existing 1/2A Scale rules where throttles are not allowed and a bonus is already given for extra engine/s.  So go ahead and have a separate category for throttle controls.  Oh well, just a thought.

I mentioned the St Louis club has had their own rules for 1/2 Scale.  One of the rules was that all of the controls had to be external.  There could be some "interesting" approaches to comply with that rule.

Keith
« Last Edit: September 08, 2022, 11:27:52 PM by Trostle »

Offline wwwarbird

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Re: Tucson 1/2A Scale Contest
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2022, 07:26:42 PM »

One of the rules for the Tucson 1/2A Multi-Engine Profile Scale contests was that each of the engines had to keep running for at least 10 laps.  I think it is both surprising and commendable that as far as I can remember, very very few of the entries failed this requirement.  I think that is a testament to the perseverance of the individual contestants and the ready assistance of all of those who attended.  There was a problem that many encountered with these little frustrating beasts.  The engines would run fine one at a time, but some experienced that the engines on these creatures seemed to talk to each other and did not like to do so.  Nevertheless, most of these things were successful and in my experience, most had an enjoyable time.


 All reasons why I enjoyed following this contest. I do remember the 10 lap engine run rule as well, a great idea. Norvel engines certainly helped, excellent once broken in. If the contest were electric models I wouldn't have been nearly as impressed or interested. I'll keep my eyes out for next years NATS coverage.  ;D
Narrowly averting disaster since 1964! 

Wayne Willey
Albert Lea, MN U.S.A. IC C/L Aircraft Modeler, Ex AMA member


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