Author Topic: Swept Canard finally makes the air! (Read 1628 times)

minnesotamodeler · « **on:** August 13, 2011, 03:28:38 PM »

Got out for the FIRST TIME the whole summer...enignes, predictably, were sorta gunked up with old castor, took some tinkering to get them running right. I think I'll loosen the others up by running a tank or 2 in my garage before going to the field.

Anyway, the Swept-wing Canard flies well, very smooth, mild-mannered, no bad habits or tendencies. It feels a little noseheavy in maneuvers so I will add some tail weight for next time. Just a slight tweaking on the design and it will be good.

Bill Barber · « **Reply #1 on:** August 13, 2011, 05:54:56 PM »

Ray I have been waiting for your flight report , interested to see after trimming if it can do
the full pattern ?
Bill

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #2 on:** August 14, 2011, 06:07:05 AM »

Quote from: Bill Barber on August 13, 2011, 05:54:56 PM

Ray I have been waiting for your flight report , interested to see after trimming if it can do
the full pattern ?
Bill

The only shortcoming right now are the square corners. Not sure if the noseheavy feel is a result of really being noseheavy, or just a characteristic of canards. I'll rebalance it and try again soon. Thanks for the interest.

kenneth cook · « **Reply #3 on:** August 14, 2011, 07:35:11 AM »

Ray, how did the model handle when the engine ran out of fuel. One of our club members seemed to feel the same way you did in terms or how the model balanced. He liked the engine under power as it stunted real well but the end of the flight was suicidal. At least it was for his airplane. His canard ended it's life after the fuel ran out. He always said though he was afraid to try and put some weight to shift the cg. I really enjoyed watching his model fly as it was in red and black checkerboard silk and looked so cool in the air. He wasn't the builder of the model and there really wasn't much to put it back together. I never built a canard and I always toy with the idea of doing so. Ken

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #4 on:** August 14, 2011, 08:08:32 PM »

I had no problem with the canard deadstick, it was about as well-mannered there as anywhere. It did still feel a little noseheavy; I wasn't able to stretch the glide as much as I wanted.

Better than the first straight-wing one; it landed where IT wanted, I had nothing to do with it. It was decidedly noseheavy; I put about 1.5 oz. of lead on the tail to make it handle reasonably well. Picture of both below for comparison.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #5 on:** August 15, 2011, 09:01:41 AM »

Glad to hear the canard is working. It would be slightly nose heavy with the engine out in the front. The Dick Sarpolous design canard that I built and fly was a little sensitive with engine mounted just in front of main wing. Woud like to build another one and eliminate the rear moving surfaces. Also mount the bellcrank out in the open just like your little 1/2A. But too many irons in the fire right now.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #6 on:** August 15, 2011, 11:18:20 AM »

Well, the swept wing was supposed to eliminate the noseheavy tendency of the engine out front...I just didn't go quite far enough with it. Need to use a little more severe forward sweep; perhaps in a future version...? Meanwhile I'm gonna see how well I can make this one fly.

Larry Renger · « **Reply #7 on:** August 16, 2011, 09:56:04 AM »

Actually, Ray, why not go to a higher aspect ratio. That will get the tips farther forward for better balance and give you a higher efficiency. Plus, more of the wing would be out of the wake of the canard.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #8 on:** August 16, 2011, 05:16:21 PM »

Quote from: Larry Renger on August 16, 2011, 09:56:04 AM

Actually, Ray, why not go to a higher aspect ratio. That will get the tips farther forward for better balance and give you a higher efficiency. Plus, more of the wing would be out of the wake of the canard.

That's certainly worth considering...current version is 28" span, 7" avg. chord--close to 200 sq. in. I could easily go to 34" span, maybe 6" chord. Or 36" x 5.5". I'd like to keep it around 200 squares. I'm also thinking I could cut down the canard/stab size a little too. It's about 30% of the wing area now. Lots of ways to go. I do enjoy developing designs.

john e. holliday · « **Reply #9 on:** August 20, 2011, 12:07:48 PM »

Leave the elevator alone and cut down the chord of the stab. Then you can move the engine back a little bit.

jim gilmore · « **Reply #10 on:** September 09, 2011, 06:32:15 PM »

Canards might work better with electric. Just a point that the motor and battery can work better at balancing the model.

I would try the motor at the rear pushing and battery over the wing towardsthe forward tail/plane/nose plane...not sure on wording but I think you get my statement..
I still like it's look. does it do the pattern ?

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #11 on:** September 09, 2011, 08:47:02 PM »

Quote from: jim gilmore on September 09, 2011, 06:32:15 PM

Canards might work better with electric. Just a point that the motor and battery can work better at balancing the model.

I would try the motor at the rear pushing and battery over the wing towardsthe forward tail/plane/nose plane...not sure on wording but I think you get my statement..
I still like it's look. does it do the pattern ?

If you're not too particular about soft corners, yes. the squares look like slightly indented round loops, if you get what I mean.

got another one on the drawing board, probably be this winter's building project.

jim gilmore · « **Reply #12 on:** September 09, 2011, 09:05:02 PM »

How much better does the second canard fly unpowered than the first ?
Looking at the plane as a whole. If it is nose have the elevator may not have enough leverage to adequatly turn the model.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #13 on:** September 09, 2011, 09:56:20 PM »

Quote from: jim gilmore on September 09, 2011, 09:05:02 PM

How much better does the second canard fly unpowered than the first ?
Looking at the plane as a whole. If it is nose have the elevator may not have enough leverage to adequatly turn the model.

The forward-swept one is considerably better than the first...the straight-wing version glided OK but control input had very little effect; it landed nicely but where it wanted to, never mind what I wanted. Whereas the newer one allows me to influence where it finally touches down! It still feels a little noseheavy but certainly easily within stunting range. One nice thing about that, it sits in a deep groove in level flight, upright and inverted. Like on a rail. I'm drawing up a modified version that will move the CG backward yet more. (Actually, it will move the center of lift forward; same result.)

Eddie Culver · « **Reply #14 on:** September 15, 2011, 05:41:33 PM »

Congrats on getting your pretty bird airborn! I think I told you that my Dad built an RC version of my latest canard and he got his flying about the same time you did. Unfortunately his controls were set up like mine. Mine is designed for square corners and he wasn't ready for that in RC. It was cool though to see my CL stunter fly as an RC version.

Anyway, I am very happy for you. I wonder, can you make drawings or plans available along with the CG marking? I may want to try someone else's canard design along with my own.
Thanks - Eddie

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #15 on:** September 16, 2011, 09:07:44 AM »

Eddie, I'll see what I can do. All I have are some CAD layouts for parts patterns and 3-view drawings. the proper CG is yet to be determined!

Author Topic: Swept Canard finally makes the air! (Read 1628 times)

minnesotamodeler

Swept Canard finally makes the air!

Bill Barber

Re: Swept Canard finally makes the air!

minnesotamodeler

Re: Swept Canard finally makes the air!

kenneth cook

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minnesotamodeler

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john e. holliday

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minnesotamodeler

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Larry Renger

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john e. holliday

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jim gilmore

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jim gilmore

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Eddie Culver

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minnesotamodeler

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