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Author Topic: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson  (Read 8801 times)

Offline RC Storick

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AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« on: October 06, 2015, 02:59:18 PM »
I had a hour long conversation with Dave today expressing our concerns over drones and AMA Dues increase. While talking to him I proposed a digital Mag only subscription and how to drop the rate for control line guys. There has not been a increase sense 03 and things just cost more now. But I am tasked to come up with a few valid solutions for a dues reduction. Please post you ideas here on what we could to to reduce cost for the CL membership.

The top five ideas will be passed to the AMA Board.
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Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2015, 03:48:28 PM »
If AMA makes a lower dues cost for C/L flyers, then where does it end?  Free Flight is also low-risk in terms of accident liability.  How about indoor flyers?  Of course, anyone doing the drone-thing will also argue that these little things pose no great accident hazard. 

AMA will say that dues increase is required because of insurance costs.  The concept of insurance premiums is based on perceived risk.  Certainly, the larger and heavier models should pose a greater risk than small planes weighing just a few ounces.

The large insurance companies have a multi-tiered premium structure based on perceived risk factors.  So should the AMA adopt the same premium structure.

This isn't a viable solution unless the AMA adopts a multi-tiered rate structure.
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Offline Doug Moon

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2015, 03:51:46 PM »
One idea is too give a break to the groups with the least in claim payouts each year.

Another is to give a break on dues for those who have paid X number of years without a break in membership and then after Y total it is free for life.  And it doesn't have to be some insane number like "80 years in and you have a lifetime."  More like 20 years in and you are paying a different rate, 30 years less, and 40 years and up free.  But if you miss a year it starts over.

Another idea is to sell MORE MORE MORE MORE MORE drone ads in MA and that profit can lower dues for everyone.  Get AMA advertising dollars in the bank and the dues could go down.

Another is, if you own a model company and you advertise in MA you get a break on your dues.

They could just charge less for their insurance coverage so our dues are less.

There are any number of ways it could be done.  All of them are going to require more work on the AMA's part, whether it be tracking people's time as a member, or tracking the claim payouts by discipline (i bet they already do this), or selling more ads etc.

Going without the magazine is not the answer.  The amount of advertising in that thing is the money maker, not the dues.  
Going without the magazine is the thought for PAMPA because SN does not make money, it does well to break even and carry a little over. Ad space in SN doesn't pay for the publication.

I would suspect the AMA will gladly listen to all thoughts on the subject but until they see a drop in membership, and a significant one at that, I would imagine they will stick with the new amount. Sure they can claim there hasn't been an increase since 2003 but then to increase it 31% is making up for the lost years all at once.  Thanks a lot!  

Also they should consider NOT going long periods without an increase to only stick it to everyone at once.  Increases are inevitable so do it slowly over time every 2 or 3 years in small increments.

Another thing they could do is break it out into a payment option, maybe 3 payments over the year. But then that requires a billing department and trying to collect on past dues etc....



Doug Moon
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Offline Fred Cronenwett

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2015, 04:47:46 PM »
When I lived in the LA area the local hobby shops would carry Model Aviation, people could buy the magazine and thus could become AMA members if they saw something that interested them.

When I moved to the Midwest in 2003 I found the nearest hobby shop and asked if they had Model Aviation available for sale and I was told that it was for members only. If the AMA made it available to the hobby shops they could increase their income, reduce our dues and also increase membership.

Fred
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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2015, 05:46:05 PM »
Reduce middle management.


MM

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2015, 06:21:10 PM »
I'd gladly pay double if they'd get out of the drone business.  Really,  the increase doesn't seem like that much considering how the costs of everything it takes to maintain and pay the bills must be greater than 2003.  Salaries,  insurance,  utilities,  maintainence and equipment,  postage,  Internet..........  Well,  my 2 cents...maybe  3 1/2 now.

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Offline wwwarbird

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2015, 06:29:43 PM »
 I think if they offered any sort of "deal" just to C/Ler's they'd only create a rift with all the other segments crying instantly.

 What they could do is offer a discounted option to everyone to be an AMA member without having to receive their worthless rag. Not gonna happen though, they're too money hungry. Myself, I am seriously considering NOT re-upping for 2016.  D>K
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Offline Dick Pacini

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2015, 06:54:57 PM »
They could price the insurance portion with a deductible, like auto or health insurance.  It could be a flat figure across the board.
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Offline YakNine

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2015, 07:06:19 PM »
I opted for the online membership only last time but haven't actually downloaded one issue yet, we have to be members to fly at our field I seriously doubt I could get the insurance on my own for less. I have only flown the last two years at the New Years fun fly , last year that was one flight at the club field between club dues and ama membership pretty pricey but to me worth every penny. The sailing club costs about the same but I probably used my boat 15 times this year , but its a lot closer and my wife likes it too.T.J.
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Offline RC Storick

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2015, 07:41:03 PM »
People need to realize this in not primary insurance it's supplementary to your home owners insurance so it really cost them nothing. My opinion is drop the rate for online mag. Of coarse I will loose my epoxy mixing platform but I could live without that.
AMA 12366

Offline john e. holliday

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2015, 08:19:39 PM »
Has it been that long since I got my first membership with AMA and it only cost me a whopping $3.00 for it.  Big money for me back then and it took several bushels of apple picking to earn it.  Have never let it drop.   I also learn a lot by reading the articles in the mag.  Yes, being on fixed income now with utilities and expenses going up it is hard,  but some how I will keep my license current.   
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Online Robert Zambelli

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More and More on Drones (Robert - please delete if inappropriate)
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2015, 11:18:14 PM »
I normally toss the model aviation magazine before I read it but I decided to have a quick look at the October issue.

Page 6: ama president holding a drone and wearing strange goggles. Is this some sort of message?
Page 9: Photo of model aviation cover showing a drone.

Drone advertisements on pages 16, 19, 26, 27, 36, 52, 56, 57, 58, 76, 77, 78, 94, 108, 114, 118 and the back cover.
I remember reading somewhere that most drone flyers were not ama members.
Seems like just by the advertising, the magazine is encouraging more and more drone activity within the membership.

Just my thoughts and observations.
It's in the trash now.

Bob Z.

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2015, 01:04:29 AM »
Bob. You nailed it....

Offline RC Storick

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2015, 07:33:06 AM »
This is our chance to be heard, Lets get some idea to present please
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Offline Doug Moon

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2015, 08:50:41 AM »
Just to play devil's advocate here, why should we get a break on our dues?

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Offline RC Storick

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2015, 09:41:24 AM »
Just to play devil's advocate here, why should we get a break on our dues?

Okay we will keep your dues at current rate.
AMA 12366

Offline Doug Moon

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2015, 12:05:34 PM »
Okay we will keep your dues at current rate.

I was being serious.  If you have an answer as to why we (control line) should have a lower rate then there's your solution.

If the answer just because you don't want to pay more then you don't have an argument. No one wants to pay more.

Doug Moon
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2015, 01:02:27 PM »
I was being serious.  If you have an answer as to why we (control line) should have a lower rate then there's your solution.

If the answer just because you don't want to pay more then you don't have an argument. No one wants to pay more.



  I agree, that's a very good question. If someone can come up with a good answer, that's what Dave Matthewson should hear.

  BTW, be very careful about CL insurance per member costs. RC guys post many more claims, but there are also 40x as many of them. Last time I knew any direct information about it, CL insurance claim cost per member was substantially higher than RC.

     Brett

Offline Bill Burton

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2015, 01:21:33 PM »
This is an exercise in futility.  AMA is not going to give a reduced rate to control line flyers.  Ain't gonna happen.

BB

Offline Dick Pacini

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2015, 01:31:43 PM »
I would imagine that a substantial amount of our dues supports the Muncie facility and any operational staff required. 
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Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #20 on: October 07, 2015, 01:35:25 PM »
I seem to remember that they gave a reduced rate to the park fliers. Do they still do that? If that is the case we should have some leverage. Not sure this is still valid or maybe never was. Just a thought.
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Offline Bill Burton

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #21 on: October 07, 2015, 01:37:24 PM »
Maybe if they paid a little more attention to the control line aspect, the control line  flyers would not consider the dues increase such a bitter pill to swallow.  I don't see them doing that either.
.BB

Offline Dick Pacini

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #22 on: October 07, 2015, 01:45:40 PM »
I seem to remember that they gave a reduced rate to the park fliers. Do they still do that? If that is the case we should have some leverage. Not sure this is still valid or maybe never was. Just a thought.
I believe the AMA insurance coverage was less for the park flier license.  I also think the Park Flier magazine was different.
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Offline BillP

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #23 on: October 08, 2015, 07:49:36 AM »
Last I saw posted the AMA had a $13+ million income, $16+ million assets and $9+ million revenue.  Where exactly is all this money being spent? Quite frankly I'm tired of seeing dues spent on AMA facilities so far away I have to take a vacation to visit them. Anyway, they could do what "for profit" companies do...hire top notch consultants (not their pals at the country club) to evaluate the AMA business model to find ways to improve. Might be good to trade the BMW in for a Chevy too.

bp 
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Offline Dick Pacini

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #24 on: October 08, 2015, 09:58:58 AM »
Last I saw posted the AMA had a $13+ million income, $16+ million assets and $9+ million revenue.  Where exactly is all this money being spent? Quite frankly I'm tired of seeing dues spent on AMA facilities so far away I have to take a vacation to visit them. Anyway, they could do what "for profit" companies do...hire top notch consultants (not their pals at the country club) to evaluate the AMA business model to find ways to improve. Might be good to trade the BMW in for a Chevy too.

bp  

There is a businessman in the news almost daily who is very wealthy and a great deal maker.  Give him a call and see if he wants to buy AMA and cut costs. S?P
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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #25 on: October 08, 2015, 10:15:09 AM »
Last I saw posted the AMA had a $13+ million income, $16+ million assets and $9+ million revenue.  Where exactly is all this money being spent? Quite frankly I'm tired of seeing dues spent on AMA facilities so far away I have to take a vacation to visit them. Anyway, they could do what "for profit" companies do...hire top notch consultants (not their pals at the country club) to evaluate the AMA business model to find ways to improve. Might be good to trade the BMW in for a Chevy too.

bp 

Are you thinking that is spending money or required reserves?  Are they secondarily insured?  I don't know how they work with that budget, but if they ever have to pay a claim for me, I hope that some of that is available.  If it is all profit, where is the competition?  Just a few thoughts as I don't know any of the answers :)
Fred
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #26 on: October 08, 2015, 10:24:30 AM »
Last I saw posted the AMA had a $13+ million income, $16+ million assets and $9+ million revenue.  Where exactly is all this money being spent? Quite frankly I'm tired of seeing dues spent on AMA facilities so far away I have to take a vacation to visit them. Anyway, they could do what "for profit" companies do...hire top notch consultants (not their pals at the country club) to evaluate the AMA business model to find ways to improve. Might be good to trade the BMW in for a Chevy too

   I think that part of the problem is looking at it like a business, and marketing it as such. A marketing consultant would likely cut away the "dead wood" like CL/FF/Competition RC and focus entirely on ARF and drone marketing, because that it where the money is right now. MA is already nearly indistinguishable from commercial magazines.  "Marketing" is exactly what all the complaints are about.   
 
   Brett

Offline RC Storick

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #27 on: October 08, 2015, 10:51:24 AM »
I had another conversation with Dave about this subject today. I have been also conveying the displeasure with some on the drone issue. We talked about the direction of model aviation and the decline in the builder. AMA membership has risen every year for the last four years so I am told opposed to what has been said on the internet. I also pointed out that All events that have done away with the BOM are in decline. For the simple fact the participant has no stake in the hobby other than monetary.

I relayed my opinion of drones and how when something happens we will all be lumped into the same group. Drones are not going away get use to it. They were at a congressional select committee meeting yesterday and were praised for their involvement so I was told. Ignoring the problem is not the answer. I personally believe that the drone fliers could care less about the AMA rules and laws. As the have bought their toy and can use it in anyway they see fit. So I said that the captain of the ship so to speak is the AMA president so if they want to see a different direction the captain has to take the helm and steer a different course. Or we shall see the same fate as Titanic running into a iceberg that 90% is hidden under the water. Out of sight just as our government.

I will do my best to find a solution in the extreme rate increase however I don't think anything will happen soon. But if we collectively speak out they will listen. So valid ideas will be relayed on to Dave and discussed with the membership directors. Strength comes in numbers and ideas with solutions not complaints.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2015, 04:23:09 PM by Robert Storick »
AMA 12366

Offline Doug Moon

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #28 on: October 08, 2015, 11:30:44 AM »
Robert,

I have found the drone guys who walk into a store and buy one and go fly are for the most part people interested in video etc. and don't even know about the AMA.

But drone guys who come from other aspects of the hobby know about the AMA and are already members and have the same thoughts and mutual respect we have.

I was reading recently on an RC forum and there were several there who thought the drone thing would fade some and some other new fad would take over.  Your actual videographers would stick with it as it is their business and the drone guys who already partake in some other form of the hobby will just add to their arsenal of things to fly.  And the spike in purchases will level off....  We will see....

I am not sure anyone else has noticed, I see so many comments from people tossing their MA before reading it, but there has been a fair amount of building in the past several issues.  Some of it is very old school building as well, pins on a building board over a plan type of stuff.  They do make attempts and many forms of model aviation.  I read the publication and I certainly notice a trend...

Doug Moon
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Offline RC Storick

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #29 on: October 08, 2015, 11:38:27 AM »
I am not sure anyone else has noticed, I see so many comments from people tossing their MA before reading it, but there has been a fair amount of building in the past several issues.  Some of it is very old school building as well, pins on a building board over a plan type of stuff.  They do make attempts and many forms of model aviation.  I read the publication and I certainly notice a trend...

We are to blame for content. I am guilty. I guess I need to submit some building articles except I have a hard time typing. I should have took it in high school but I thought I would never need it. Oh well live and learn. I bet I can do about 35 small words a minute and I am getting better with both hands and not looking at the key board. This skill has been self taught on this forum over the last 10 years.

EDIT: I lied this took 1.5 minutes to type.
AMA 12366

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #30 on: October 08, 2015, 12:17:19 PM »
Well, Robert, remember that all magazines have paid staff whose job is to edit both your submitted text and, usually, to re-draw your plans to meet their requirements.  You don't have to be an English major, or a professional draftsman to submit your manuscript.  I'm sure they're used to it.

However, the chances of having your manuscript published might improve if your submission is well written, complete, and clearly drafted.

Floyd
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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #31 on: October 08, 2015, 01:28:04 PM »
   I think that part of the problem is looking at it like a business, and marketing it as such. A marketing consultant would likely cut away the "dead wood" like CL/FF/Competition RC and focus entirely on ARF and drone marketing, because that it where the money is right now. MA is already nearly indistinguishable from commercial magazines.  "Marketing" is exactly what all the complaints are about.   
 
   Brett


It is a non profit business and I doubt they would have been around this long running it like it wasn't one. Also, "marketing consultants" are not the type of consultants I'm talking about. Business consultants critique all segments of the operation and see if the company is following best business practices, costs, accounting, manpower, facilities, etc. They evaluate everything and bring findings and improvement suggestions to the table..."marketing consultants" might be one of their suggestions.

No matter what, the AMA heads are in it for the money and have to sell their "product" to stay solvent. It would be interesting to see what % they contribute to their members over and above the % Uncle Sam requires to remain a legal non profit. I think the drone money is what they are following now and anything control line is no longer a blip on their radar screen because it doesn't generate enough revenue. In their defense, they have to keep up with technology or get left behind.  As far as anyone at AMA listening to our suggestions...my opinion is they have ignored cl for years and I doubt they care any more than it takes to convince sanctioned clubs they must have insurance and to the rest of us to send in dues.

bp
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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #32 on: October 08, 2015, 02:14:26 PM »
We are to blame for content. I am guilty. I guess I need to submit some building articles except I have a hard time typing. I should have took it in high school but I thought I would never need it. Oh well live and learn. I bet I can do about 35 small words a minute and I am getting better with both hands and not looking at the key board. This skill has been self taught on this forum over the last 10 years.

EDIT: I lied this took 1.5 minutes to type.

Robert. The late Kenn Smith wrote some articles for the AMA magazine. When they started to faze out a regular C/L Articles/Column.  Due to lack of C/L In put as they put it.. He told them that he would guarantee a C/L article for print in every monthly issue.
  Their exact reply was Thanks but NO thanks.
 As for me speaking. I do not think they care....One way or the other. It's all about $$$$$ in their coffers.

Offline Stew Robinson

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #33 on: October 08, 2015, 03:37:03 PM »
I was going to join in order to fly with a club in my area. It would be cool to meet some others who share the hobby. When they announced the rate increase, I decided to keep flying where I can, without the club aspect of it.
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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #34 on: October 08, 2015, 04:57:23 PM »
I personally think that real drones (FPV, not flown line of sight), should be excluded altogether from the AMA, and the other ones lumped in with the helicopter guys.
I feel that they (the guys flying FPV Multirotors) will be the downfall of sport RC.
As such, if the AMA wants to suck up to them, it should be done separately, so that our sport flying can remain as it is, and was. But that's just me.
And the funds should be separate also.

I'm not very impressed with the AMA. I have lately lost respect for them. They seem to be chasing $$$$$ with regard to the "new technology" and I suspect that sport pilots (especially RC, where I came from) will be left paying the price for the "New technology" even if we aren't using or participating in it.
I think that C/L will be relatively safe, and be able to continue, but that my true love (R/C soaring of thermal sailplanes) is doomed to be restricted to an FPV induced altitude restriction.
I hope I'm wrong, but I really don't think I will be, just a matter of time.

The whole rate increase is just adding insult to injury, because I can assure you that the percentage of non AMA drone guys is likely 3-4 times that of any fixed wing RC or control line population. They simply do not care and there is no reason for them to join.
R,
Chris
Regards,
Chris
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Offline Dick Pacini

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #35 on: October 08, 2015, 05:18:10 PM »
There is one very small aspect of AMA membership that hasn't been mentioned.  The AMA issued license number on your airplane.  To me it is like that vanity license plate on a car that is paid for every year the plate is renewed.  Once you have it, you don't want to let it go.  My cell phone number has been the same since the day my phone had a corded handset and a suitcase full of batteries.  I recently got a new phone with a different carrier and had my old number transferred.  It is my number and I want to keep it.

Those who never entered a sanctioned contest probably don't care about the wing number because they really don't need one, although I believe AMA membership requires the issued license number to be on the model.   I left AMA for 35 or so years and was very fortunate to be able to get my old number back when I re-joined.

I know the number certainly isn't worth the cost of membership but it is a small part of the membership package that might tip the scales a bit to generate a renewal.
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Offline Myron Firmin

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #36 on: October 08, 2015, 06:27:45 PM »
If the PAMPA membership and magazine were included, that would be worth it!
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Offline Stew Robinson

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #37 on: October 08, 2015, 06:37:14 PM »
Has anyone ever attempted to buy group/club insurance in order to fly C/L at a distinct location?

I'd be interested to hear if it was feasible, or even possible
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Offline Keith Miller

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #38 on: October 08, 2015, 08:03:05 PM »
Just to play devil's advocate here, why should we get a break on our dues?


Okay we will keep your dues at current rate.

Doug has a point. And for those of us who fly in multiple classes (CL, RC, FF), would the AMA then ask me to pay a separate rate for each one, thus increasing my cost?

Offline George

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #39 on: October 09, 2015, 09:39:35 AM »
There have been a lot of valid points made but I believe the bottom line is that it is like school taxes...everybody pays.

George
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Offline tom hampshire

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #40 on: October 09, 2015, 10:47:56 AM »
     Stew, you have your finger on the pulse.  The AMA insurance program was established decades ago primarily to permit site owners to have insurance, increasing the likelihood that they would be willing to allow a contest to occur at all.  A flier can purchase liability coverage (homeowners or renters) which will pay claims made against him personally.  Not so for the owner of the flying site, who also faces claims for allowing the activity on his property.  In general, commercial lines insurance carriers have no loss data on model flying in any form, and are thus unwilling to write a policy for a site owner at all.  There might be some situation where they would do so in order to protect a relationship with a major client, but the chance of running across it is minimal.  The membership benefit of personal insurance is only incidental to the main purpose of the AMA insurance program, which is an inducement to site owners to allow flying in the first place. 
      About 12 or 15 years ago, there was an attempt to start a competing organization, the Sport Fliers of America.  They promised insurance, and collected money for 'premiums', up until it came to light that no policies were ever written, and there were no reserves and no ability to actually pay claims.  The whole thing collapsed.  The moral of the story is that the AMA has a strong record of issuing legitimate policies and paying claims.  I'd be very reluctant to try another insurance source.

      One other thing.  As matters stand, the AMA holds a 501c3 determination from the IRS that it is a legitimate charity, based on the scholarship program and the educational benefits of model flying.  The insurance program which is a part of the whole enterprise is thus non-taxable.  If the AMA wanted to divide the various areas of model flying into separate risk categories, doing so would involve risk that the IRS would find the insurance activity to be a for profit activity, and impose income tax on whatever 'net profit' might result from the insurance program as a whole.  Let's call this 'audit risk'.  I am aware that past AMA managements have declined to offer differing (risk adjusted) insurance rates because of this.  Now it appears that present management has done so in order to try to increase market share in the parkflyer area.  Audit risk should be considered whenever the suggestion comes up that this or that form of model flying should get a special deal on coverage.  An IRS proceeding will be very complex, with numerous extraneous factors to be considered, but I would never suggest that the AMA should take any chances at all.  My own thought on all of this has always been that all of us are in the same boat, and the last thing we need is internal warfare over what is really a very modest annual expenditure.  IMO, what we all need in the first instance is the biggest baddest lobbying effort we can muster.

     

Offline RC Storick

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #41 on: October 09, 2015, 01:55:49 PM »
A lot of valid points and as far as I can see it the only discount that could work at all is opting out of the magazine subscription as a discount of the print and postage plus labor. About $10.00 sounds good to me.
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Offline John Rist

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #42 on: October 09, 2015, 02:28:42 PM »
A lot of valid points and as far as I can see it the only discount that could work at all is opting out of the magazine subscription as a discount of the print and postage plus labor. About $10.00 sounds good to me.

Advertising is based on mag circulation - reduce circulation reduce AMA income.
John Rist
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Offline Target

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #43 on: October 09, 2015, 09:58:40 PM »
Maybe that is what needs to happen? (Reduce ama income).
Maybe the FPV pilots can pick up the slack.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2015, 08:31:16 AM by Chris Behm »
Regards,
Chris
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Offline Tom Niebuhr

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #44 on: October 10, 2015, 12:18:33 PM »
If they won't discount for no magazine, perhaps they could allow payment in installments..??
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Online Brett Buck

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #45 on: October 10, 2015, 12:49:47 PM »
Advertising is based on mag circulation - reduce circulation reduce AMA income.


   I think it probably should be reduced. It's my opinion that the AMA should be greatly de-scoped.

    Brett

Offline JoeJust

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #46 on: October 10, 2015, 04:11:44 PM »
Ever wonder what might happen if he AMA ended. Who gets the property? Will anyone pick up what might be left and run an updated organization Without new young members coming along in the next 20 years will the AMA survive? Do we really care?
Joe
I only enter contests so somebody else is not always in last place

Offline Bill Burton

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #47 on: October 10, 2015, 09:54:01 PM »

   I think it probably should be reduced. It's my opinion that the AMA should be greatly de-scoped.

    Brett

AMEN Brett

Offline Doug Moon

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #48 on: October 12, 2015, 10:25:28 AM »
A lot of valid points and as far as I can see it the only discount that could work at all is opting out of the magazine subscription as a discount of the print and postage plus labor. About $10.00 sounds good to me.

It has been said before but the "no magazine option" would actually hurt the AMA income.  They can sell their ads to hobbyking and great planes based on the guaranteed subscription number of recipients. They don't save money if they don't send you a magazine.  They actually lose money.  They cant charge as much for an ad if their guaranteed subscription base is reduced. It's a simple concept and it works. If half the AMA opts out of MA and the AD revenue drops who is going to make up the difference?  You guessed it, you and me. 

This is not PAMPA where the magazine is the main expense for the organization.

That is why I said earlier they should be encouraged to sell MORE ads for MORE income and rely less on dues to cover the costs of the insurance.... 
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Online Tony Drago

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Re: AMA Dues and Dave Mathewson
« Reply #49 on: October 12, 2015, 03:30:16 PM »
Some years back around 1992. I was talking to a Representative  form Hot Rod Magazine ( have friends that had/have articles published in the magazine)when I was restoring a couple of 65 Chevelle's.
  The discussion was very informative. Bottom line was they make so much money off of the advertisements that they could figuratively give the magazine away for free.
   Ever wonder after why your subscription rules out and you don't renew for awhile they then any only then give you the really cheap renewal subscription fee. Why not from the beginning?
 Its all about bottom line. $$$$$ I for one believe the AMA is only friends with its self with a give me , give  me attitude.


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