Author Topic: My LA HEAT (Read 32938 times)

frank carlisle · « **on:** February 11, 2007, 05:01:32 PM »

I started my LA HEAT way last January and I'm still working on it.
I've been off in 1/2A land with some of the fellows building.........well, little airplanes. It's been fun doing an on line build because I've gotten to share my project with others and have gotten lots of insightful help on the 1/2A models.

I hope that whoever reads this thread will kick in with advice or comments as I go along. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

RSM is interested in using pix of my Heat on their website and I've put them off for way too long. Hopefully this thread will help me stay on track. I'd like to have it finished in two weeks. So please any help will be appreciated.

I put it back on the work bench Friday and discovered that I'd really botched the bottom of the plane. Yesterday I cut the bottom off and replaced it. So that's where I'm at right now.

Tonite I plan on putting the first coat of dope on the new balsa and I'm going to get it covered by tomorrow.

The finish is silk span and Brodak dope. I'll post pictures of the top and bottom as it sits now and also a picture of how bad the bottom looked before I repaired it.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #1 on:** February 11, 2007, 05:06:30 PM »

Here is what the bottom looked like before I repaired it.

The plans had called for 3" sections of 1/8 balsa to be glued on the bottom crossgrain. I really blew that one but it's straightened out now. Look at the picture---pretty bad huh? The cracks and wiffles were too much to tolerate.

Leester · « **Reply #2 on:** February 11, 2007, 05:32:36 PM »

Frank: Keep up the great job, it's gonna look even better now.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #3 on:** February 11, 2007, 06:35:34 PM »

Thanks Lee--------if you see antwhere on it that looks like it could use detail please post that idea. I'm having fun painting the little spots.

I got the first coat of clear on the repair area. While I was at it I painted the end of the tail black and painted in wheel well something or other. The wheel something or other looks like it needs more but I'm stumped any ideas?

BTW---look at the size of those wheels!

RC Storick · « **Reply #4 on:** February 11, 2007, 06:59:51 PM »

Frank just a suggestion on your stars and bars. You have the white squares too big. The need to go in a straight line with the star or as close as possible. So if you haven't cleared it yet you might look into that.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #5 on:** February 11, 2007, 07:03:18 PM »

Quote from: Robert Storick on February 11, 2007, 06:59:51 PM

Frank just a suggestion on your stars and bars. You have the white squares too big. The need to go in a straight line with the star or as close as possible. So if you haven't cleared it yet you might look into that.

I know...........how would you go about erasing what is there? Sand it off? There is no clear on top of it yet. There are four star and bar insignia on the plane so I hope there is a simple way to fix it. Does the bottom of the box look o.k.?

Edited to add picture and say "I knew the answer would be sand it off"--I mean why not? It's the most pain staking method possible. I tried 1000 grit but I figured it was too slow and probably wouldn't leave enough tooth for the touch up paint to stick. So I went to 600 grit. I got half of it off in about 40 minutes. The star was a little crooked so I decided to get the whole thing off and do it over.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #6 on:** February 12, 2007, 11:35:24 AM »

Ya know, Frank, that is going to be a very impressive plane when you get it into the air, transport to the field not withstanding.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #7 on:** February 12, 2007, 02:43:24 PM »

Thanks Randy---------as you ca HIHI%%n see,the thing we both have in common is having to go back and do things over. I'm going to try to do everything right the first time on the next one.
Nice to hear from you man.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #8 on:** February 12, 2007, 06:59:16 PM »

Just about every body that's had a look at the Heat said something about the Stars and Bars insignia not being right. I really don't want to spend an entire flying season having people telling me that at the circle. That is to me a good reason to make it right. Right?

I dropped down to 400 grit wet paper and mixed a little soap with the water and now it's completely sanded off. I guess the next step is to paint the area white again and then re-do the insignia and get it right this time. I'll tell you something.....every time I do something like this I get a little better at finishing a model airplane.

Here is where it's at now(picture). I'm going to go mask off the area and re-paint it white. Before I spray I'll come look here to see if anyone sees a step I missed. I could use the help so if you see I'm doing something wrong tell me here, don't let me go to the circle with mistakes.

Roger Vizioli · « **Reply #9 on:** February 12, 2007, 07:42:01 PM »

Frank,
If you are not sure of what Sparky was saying, Google "P-47 Thunderbolt" for some examples.
Roger

frank carlisle · « **Reply #10 on:** February 12, 2007, 07:56:39 PM »

Quote from: Roger Vizioli on February 12, 2007, 07:42:01 PM

Frank,
If you are not sure of what Sparky was saying, Google "P-47 Thunderbolt" for some examples.
Roger

Great idea Roger. I wish I'd have thought of that. I'm going to do just that. Plus I have a "History of Aviation" book to research in also. Trust me I don't want to get it wrong again. Although in all honesty I think mine is more balanced and more appealing to the eye.

RC Storick · « **Reply #11 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:02:03 PM »

Quote from: frank carlisle on February 12, 2007, 07:56:39 PM

Great idea Roger. I wish I'd have thought of that. I'm going to do just that. Plus I have a "History of Aviation" book to research in also. Trust me I don't want to get it wrong again. Although in all honesty I think mine is more balanced and more appealing to the eye.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #12 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:05:02 PM »

Thanks Robert..................can you give me one that has a red bar in the center on each side?
Did I do the erasure right?

RC Storick · « **Reply #13 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:07:18 PM »

Quote from: frank carlisle on February 12, 2007, 08:05:02 PM

Thanks Robert..................can you give me one that has a red bar in the center on each side?
Did I do the erasure right?

frank carlisle · « **Reply #14 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:13:27 PM »

Quote from: Robert Storick on February 12, 2007, 08:07:18 PM

That's the ticket!! Thanks.
Keep an eye on me Bob......if I'm heading in a bad direction, let me know.
That area is almost white again. Tomorrow I'll have another go at the insignia.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #15 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:40:45 PM »

The area I've been working on came out pretty good. You can't even tell there was ever anything painted there and I didn't sand through the silkspan or damage any of the surrounding area.
This little job was a great excercise in getting a better feel for how far you can go with the sanding.

Sparky, tomorrow I am going to try painting trim tab detail on the flaps, elevator and rudder. I'm going to try the way you did it in one of your pictures where you'd taped off wing panel detail where the wing meets the fuselage. Here is my plan. Cut a strip of tape the width of the line I want. Place the tape where the line goes. Mask either side of the tape line. Pull up that first piece of tape and spray. Is that how you did it?

RC Storick · « **Reply #16 on:** February 12, 2007, 08:53:25 PM »

Yep all except I used 1/16 pinstriping tape as a guide.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #17 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:04:24 PM »

Quote from: Robert Storick on February 12, 2007, 08:53:25 PM

Yep all except I used 1/16 pinstriping tape as a guide.

Thanks............I'll have a picture tomorrow of how it all comes out.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #18 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:05:26 PM »

Frank, that is gonna be one gorgeous plane. I'd be afraid to fly it. So I'm glad it's yours and not mine. Could you videotape a flight, when you get to that stage? With sound? Love to hear those 2 engines singing together...

--Ray

frank carlisle · « **Reply #19 on:** February 12, 2007, 09:41:47 PM »

Quote from: minnesotamodeler on February 12, 2007, 09:05:26 PM

Frank, that is gonna be one gorgeous plane. I'd be afraid to fly it. So I'm glad it's yours and not mine. Could you videotape a flight, when you get to that stage? With sound? Love to hear those 2 engines singing together...

--Ray

You bet your bippie I'm going to get video of it flying. And speaking of engine sounds.....I'm going to put two Brodak .40s in it. That's like .80 displacement. Granted the Brodaks aren't a PA 60 but between them they'll walk all over that PA.
Big Art is doing the engine work. I'll have a total of five to choose from. OOOOHHHH.
Check out the pics. Man that's what I call nose candy!

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #20 on:** February 13, 2007, 01:54:18 AM »

You may want to slightly enlarge the exhaust holes in those mufflers, Frank...looks pretty restrictive.

Yeah, that's gonna be one impressive plane at the circle.

--Ray

frank carlisle · « **Reply #21 on:** February 13, 2007, 06:07:35 AM »

Quote from: minnesotamodeler on February 13, 2007, 01:54:18 AM

You may want to slightly enlarge the exhaust holes in those mufflers, Frank...looks pretty restrictive.

Yeah, that's gonna be one impressive plane at the circle.

--Ray

I agree Ray. It's going to be pretty impressive. Ever since I can remember I've wanted a twin engine stunter. This one is big! And colorful. Wayne Willey drew up the paint scheme for me and when I saw it I knew I'd have to paint it up like that. He even picked the colors. I plan on mailing him some pics of the Arrow and hopefully he'll put together another great paint scheme.

I know you were just kidding about the holes in the muffler ( you 1/2A guys!) but since I have a camera I figured I'd post a picture of the bottom side of the muffs.
Did you know that a hole is the cheapest thing you can add to a model?

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #22 on:** February 13, 2007, 08:39:11 AM »

...and the lightest...

I thought maybe the holes were on the bottom but it looked pretty funny from the top, no visible outlets at all, top, sides or end.

Say, I like the plans they're lying on!

--Ray

frank carlisle · « **Reply #23 on:** February 13, 2007, 10:08:13 PM »

I GOT SOMETHING DONE TODAY...................I painted trim tabs on the elevators and flaps. I taped them off the way Sparky showed how he does it. They came out pretty good. Only problem I had was when I unmasked them I realized that I had painted the tabs on the hinge line, DOH! So I sanded them off and re-painted the area. Then I did them again.
Doing the tabs twice took all day.

Now that the trim tabs are painted on I can see another problem on the horizon........the whole plane needs panel lines!!
I have no idea about how full scale planes are put together or where the panel lines should go. So I am going to use a scale plastic model of a P-40 as a...............well, as a model.

Tomorrow I plan to cover the repair on the bottom of the plane and get it primed. I'm going to try to get something done on the model everyday and post pics here.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #24 on:** February 15, 2007, 01:42:02 PM »

I'm making progress. Yesterday I erased the stars & bars insignia on the sides of the plane and got those areas re-painted white. I'm not taking chances on getting them wrong again so I ordered stencils cut. I took a sheet of Sig insignia decals and they scanned those for cutting the stencils. That gives me one thing I won't have to make excuses for.
I also painted trim tabs on the elevators and flaps.
Today I painted rudder lines on the vertical fin as well as the Miami Blue trim. And I painted the U.S. Air Force thing just under the canopy. Later, after that stuff gases off some, I plan to flip the plane over and put the same stuff on the other side.
Someone said there should be two pilots in a twin. they're there.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #25 on:** February 15, 2007, 02:13:11 PM »

I dunno, Frank, they look a little too affectionate for me, if you know what I mean...looks like one's sitting in the other's lap.

--Ray

frank carlisle · « **Reply #26 on:** February 15, 2007, 04:00:41 PM »

Quote from: minnesotamodeler on February 15, 2007, 02:13:11 PM

I dunno, Frank, they look a little too affectionate for me, if you know what I mean...looks like one's sitting in the other's lap.

--Ray

They're not gay just happy. Budgetary restraints precluded giving them much wriggle room. Besides they'll have to stay alert to maneuver the airplane.

minnesotamodeler · « **Reply #27 on:** February 15, 2007, 05:03:48 PM »

Kinda like a flying motorcycle, I guess. OK.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #28 on:** February 15, 2007, 05:18:10 PM »

originally the plane was built as a single seater but neither of the pilots is very good so we shoehorned in another chair, figuring between the two of them we might have an o.k. pilot. I promised them if they crashed the plane I'd stop their little plastic heads into paste. I think the one in the back has to go potty. I told him to hold it. Dang pilots!!

bob branch · « **Reply #29 on:** February 16, 2007, 08:55:08 PM »

The pics don't do the plane nor the 2 pilots justice. I was over at Frank's yesterday, and in the flesh with the size of the plane, the 2 pilots really do look right. The canopy is really big and to have one pilot in it would have looked not as good as the two. I had noticed in the previous pics how they looked and it was something I wanted to see how it came off in real life. Its pretty cool and pretty reasonable. In aerobatic aircraft you frequently see two in a canopy appear that close because the rear's feet pass beside the front seat. The rudder pedals for the rear are often in the front seat area or ahead of it. I have plans of a number of homebuilts that work out this way in 100% scale.

bob

frank carlisle · « **Reply #30 on:** February 16, 2007, 08:57:34 PM »

Thanks Bob, that should set these guys straight.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #31 on:** February 16, 2007, 10:14:45 PM »

Frankie,

I quit using "human" pilots. They kept crashing planes. I go with aliens or superheros now. They seem to have better reflexes.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #32 on:** February 17, 2007, 12:40:43 AM »

Quote from: Randy Powell on February 16, 2007, 10:14:45 PM

Frankie,

I quit using "human" pilots. They kept crashing planes. I go with aliens or superheros now. They seem to have better reflexes.

Hi Randy,
This my last time around with measly humans. If these two guys mess up. I'm going to get an R-2 unit for the next one.

Jim Treace · « **Reply #33 on:** February 17, 2007, 07:30:14 AM »

Frank:
Been following your progress. Very impressive and I have enjoyed the lessons of doing it right. Anyway, as a former pilot, I agree that some models just don't deserve human pilots. My grandkids picked out the pilot for our slightly modified cockpit Smoothie. An old fish bait with a smile. So far, he has not messed up, but if he does, I'll just pull him, put the hooks back in and throw him in the water!
Jim

frank carlisle · « **Reply #34 on:** February 17, 2007, 09:03:14 AM »

Quote from: Jim Treace on February 17, 2007, 07:30:14 AM

Frank:
Been following your progress. Very impressive and I have enjoyed the lessons of doing it right. Anyway, as a former pilot, I agree that some models just don't deserve human pilots. My grandkids picked out the pilot for our slightly modified cockpit Smoothie. An old fish bait with a smile. So far, he has not messed up, but if he does, I'll just pull him, put the hooks back in and throw him in the water!
Jim

Jim, thanks for sharing your pilot. Indeed if he screws up throw in the drink!! If my guys mess up I'll stomp them into paste then burn 'em................... From the little I can see of your Smoothie it's looking good. You should post whole picture of it mn.

s per the HEAT. I finally got around to re-covering the bottom of it and am now in the process of doping it. One more coat then I'll let it sit overnight and tomorrow I'll sand and prime it. I'll move all the masking down a little before I prime., that way I'll have it sort of feathered into the rest of the finish. Hopefully I make it a seamless repair.

don Burke · « **Reply #35 on:** February 17, 2007, 09:15:50 AM »

I've run into the uneven the surface thing anytime I've used cross grain sheeting, it's caused by the glue lines. The fix is as done, run the sheeting grain fore/aft. If there are enough bulkheads under it there will be no danger of crushing when handling by the fuselage. If one wants to ensure no crushing run 1/8 x 1/4 diagonals to triangulate the bays between the bulkheads to support the sheeting.

The HEAT looks great, should be awesome in the air, there's something about a twin-engine beat that's really cool to hear.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #36 on:** February 17, 2007, 09:32:14 AM »

Quote from: don Burke on February 17, 2007, 09:15:50 AM

I've run into the uneven the surface thing anytime I've used cross grain sheeting, it's caused by the glue lines. The fix is as done, run the sheeting grain fore/aft. If there are enough bulkheads under it there will be no danger of crushing when handling by the fuselage. If one wants to ensure no crushing run 1/8 x 1/4 diagonals to triangulate the bays between the bulkheads to support the sheeting.

The HEAT looks great, should be awesome in the air, there's something about a twin-engine beat that's really cool to hear.

Thanks for offering a cure Don. Next time I'll give it a try. Of course right now I'm leaaning toward always running the bottom/top blocks with grain running paralell to the fuselage.

Yeah I think it will be pretty cool at the circle. If I fly it well it should be worth maybe 30 or 40 more points than usual. That would give a trophy or two extra.
Of course you know, I've been following Sparky's threads and that pretty P-47 of his is inspiring me to go ahead and do a bit more work than I usually do.

Greg L Bahrman · « **Reply #37 on:** February 17, 2007, 08:57:55 PM »

<If one wants to ensure no crushing run 1/8 x 1/4 diagonals to triangulate the bays between the bulkheads to support the sheeting.>

Worked for me

RC Storick · « **Reply #38 on:** February 20, 2007, 04:16:35 AM »

Frank I see only one killer of the deal (at least for me it would be) Using two .40 means .021 lines but if you used two Aero tiger .36 you could use .018 lines.

Glad to help out!

frank carlisle · « **Reply #39 on:** February 20, 2007, 04:58:27 AM »

Quote from: Robert Storick on February 20, 2007, 04:16:35 AM

Frank I see only one killer of the deal (at least for me it would be) Using two .40 means .021 lines but if you used two Aero tiger .36 you could use .018 lines.

Glad to help out!

I've thought about that some. And I'd surely be willing to make a switch. I'm very familiar with the .40s and .018 lines. BUT............know nothing about .021 lines or Aero tiger .36s.

About the lines...........how much difference can .003 make?

RC Storick · « **Reply #40 on:** February 20, 2007, 05:24:48 AM »

Try it for yourself. Take you .40 size plane that you fly with .015 and put some .018 on it and fly it again, then you tell me. Then remember you will need to double the flop with .006 more with the .021. If it wasn't a problem why would the top guns be trying to fly their .040 size planes on .012 solids and 60 size planes on .014 solids. Trust me there is something to it.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #41 on:** February 20, 2007, 05:51:39 AM »

I can't argue with logic like that. I still don't know quite what to do. This plane is going to have to really fly good or at least garner more points before I commit to building another one. Best course of action I can see is carry on with what I'm doing and let it play out.

Two AT.36s equals one hi-zoot tuned pipe .70. And I'm in favor of sticking with my Victory plane for an airframe and giving it more power. Right?

Randy Powell · « **Reply #42 on:** February 20, 2007, 03:17:12 PM »

Frank,

I've gotten excellent service from Randy. I'm certainly no superstar.

Robert,

>>Take you .40 size plane that you fly with .015 and put some .018 on it and fly it again, then you tell me.<<

I fly .40 sized planes on both .015s and .018s. Truth is, I like the .018s better. They don't stretch as much. I get a more positive feel with them. Flying on .015s feels like flying with rubber bands for lines. To me, anyway.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #43 on:** February 20, 2007, 04:07:34 PM »

I've been working on the Heat--getting the bottom repaired. So far it is covered again and has enough clear on it to sand then I'll put primer on and go for the finish.
I'm waiting on stars and bars stencils right now. Even though work is getting done on the plane it still looks the same--so no pictures today.

Randy Powell · « **Reply #44 on:** February 21, 2007, 10:54:00 PM »

Frank,

I know the feeling. I'm waiting on a gallon of thinner to get here so I can get on with mine.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #45 on:** February 22, 2007, 01:02:35 AM »

Quote from: Randy Powell on February 21, 2007, 10:54:00 PM

Frank,

I know the feeling. I'm waiting on a gallon of thinner to get here so I can get on with mine.

I'm in the same boat. I ordered thinner and clear. The clear was out of stock. So I have a gallon of thinner and no clear!!

frank carlisle · « **Reply #46 on:** February 27, 2007, 10:50:19 AM »

The bottom is primed now. The plane is buried under all that masking and drop cloths.

I have stars and bars stencils coming today so pretty soon I'll be able to post something more interesting than a plane under a bunch of rags.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #47 on:** March 04, 2007, 02:47:57 PM »

The bottom planking on the HEAT has been replaced and refinished...that took some doing!! It's best to get it right the first time.

This is the 11th stunter I've built. The first 7 got built in the 70's and 80's. So this one makes just 4 since 2001. I'm a lot rusty. So I guess it's natural to need to go back and "fix" things.

I started masking the bottom of the wing yesterday and have just gotten it ready to spray the red and blue. I think it took about 10 hours altogether to get it masked and ready to paint. I have to say that the two engine nacelles made it really a complicated and tedious job. After this there is only the stabilizer and wheel pants to get colors on and then it will be time for stencils and pinstriping.

Leester · « **Reply #48 on:** March 04, 2007, 03:12:45 PM »

Hey Frank: That planes so big you should count it as 2 stunters. That is going to be just Awsome Dude.

frank carlisle · « **Reply #49 on:** March 04, 2007, 03:17:57 PM »

It's actually three planes when you're working on the nose Lee.

It sure takes a lot of masking to get 'er done!

Here it is with the red painted on. Later I'll spray the blue and uncover it. I sure hope I didn't get a lot of overspray.