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Author Topic: Free Style  (Read 2878 times)

Offline Motorman

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Free Style
« on: May 25, 2015, 09:18:10 PM »
Anyone ever make up there own stunts? How about a free style event judged on creativity and difficulty. 8 leaf clover, horizontal hour glass?

MM

Mike Griffin

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2015, 09:50:08 PM »
Well....lets see...."...

We could do the Octagon, then go into a parallelogram, throw in a Pentagon, The Star of David, A thought bubble, and end it with the Big Dipper. That should be worth 800 points.

Offline Dane Martin

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2015, 10:31:37 PM »
At the ringmaster round up there's an unknown pattern. Horizontal hourglass, inverted triangles, and cool looking stuff like that. Last year Joe Gilbert and David Gressens flew it. Really cool to watch

Offline Trostle

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2015, 12:13:19 AM »
This subject comes up on a fairly regular cycle.  Some have actually done something about it, like mentioned above with the Ring Master events.  There have been efforts to reenact the Mirror Meet pattern which by all accounts if a very demanding pattern.  (Perhaps the Tulsa guys can offer some comments about this or whoever else has worked to resurrect the Mirror Meet pattern.)  In 1954, the successor to Air Trails published a two page article filled with diagrams of several dozen maneuvers suggested by some of the top fliers of that time.  Some of those maneuvers were eventually selected by George Aldrich when he devised the pattern as we now know it.  As mentioned above, there are many more ideas for "neat sounding" tricks that have been put forward.  

As neat as the idea sounds to have a "free style" event, the maneuvers still become not much more than a series of loops and/or sudden turns (as in squares, or triangles or some other multi-sided shapes in various sequences placed on various parts of our hemisphere.  Yes, there can be some very imaginative figures conjured up, but they are still loops and sudden turns which pretty well describes our current pattern which is flown essentially in a two dimensional medium that is a bit warped so that it looks like the surface of a hemisphere.

Now, if one were to get really creative, why not come up with maneuvers that really place a premium on pilot ability as well as model capabilities.  For instance, do a vertical eight under a 60 degree elevation.  Or get more points by getting that vertical eight  is even less than 60 degrees.  Or more simply put, do the entire pattern within a set of 30 degree and 60 degree parameters insetead of the current pattern which is defined with 45 and 90 degree parameters.  (This one would really separate the really good flying combinations since few really come close to flying all of our current 45/90 degree pattern now.)  Several in the past have come up with maneuver diagrams that could be flown that really place a challenge to the plane/pilot combination.  The demands could be established that go beyond current "typical" stunt model design.  Maybe this could be a good thing, but there does not seem to be much appetite for it.

These ideas are to be encouraged,  But nothing much happens as there does not seem to be much interest for someone or a group to get together and draft some ideas and then run an event (contest?) using those ideas.  It could start out by just using present designs, but if a quantum leap in performance would be required to perform to the new rules, then new designs and new construction techniques would be required.  It seems our community is not too interested in actually doing something about it other than writing about it and expect someone else to initiate something.

Keith
« Last Edit: May 26, 2015, 09:27:52 AM by Trostle »

Offline Tim Wescott

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #4 on: May 26, 2015, 12:28:31 AM »
Anyone ever make up there own stunts?

I believe you are thinking of the beginner pattern, as it is usually flown.
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Offline Bob Hunt

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #5 on: May 26, 2015, 03:57:40 AM »
I believe you are thinking of the beginner pattern, as it is usually flown.

Now, that's funny!  ;D

Bob Hunt

Mike Griffin

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #6 on: May 26, 2015, 06:23:27 AM »
Good one Tim.  I remember doing that.

Mike

Offline De Hill

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #7 on: May 26, 2015, 07:48:40 AM »
The Tulsa Gluedobbers ran a freestyle event about 20 years ago. I had listened to George Aldrich talk about a Freestyle contest in Texas in the late 1940's and thought it might be fun to run at our Gluedobber contest.

We had about 6 entries the first year, and it slowly wound down. After 4 years, The contestants suggested that we run Profile Stunt instead; we did, and the entries tripled. 

I believe that the Saint Louis club, the Lafayette Escadrille also ran Freestyle Stunt for a few years.
De Hill

Offline Sean McEntee

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #8 on: May 26, 2015, 08:46:37 PM »
We had about 6 entries the first year, and it slowly wound down. After 4 years, The contestants suggested that we run Profile Stunt instead; we did, and the entries tripled. 

I believe that the Saint Louis club, the Lafayette Escadrille also ran Freestyle Stunt for a few years.

   Same thing happened to the St Louis event...just died off as the Profile Stunt event gained popularity.

   I flew at the Mirror Meet/Triathlon contest in Tulsa in 2007.  The Triathlon portion was balloon burst/beginner pattern/50 lap race.  Lots of fun.

   http://stunthanger.com/smf/index.php/topic,18088.0.html

   The Mirror Meet pattern was really something to try to do.  Any wind made the upwind maneuvers especially difficult.  30 maneuvers in all to include a spot landing.  We used a 1' square linoleum tile that you had to stop on.  The Tulsa contest split up the pattern into two rounds for refueling purposes, though the idea back then was to complete the entire pattern on one tank of fuel.  No minimum altitude either...the lower the better!

    Then me an Joe Gilbert got out the Ringmasters and did some team stunt! 

    One of my favorite contest memories.

Offline De Hill

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #9 on: May 26, 2015, 09:19:05 PM »
Hi Sean,


I remember it well; I was the C.D. at that contest. The original Mirror meet actually allowed a pit stop without penalty. Very few people had a large enough fuel tank to complete the pattern. The bottom of the maneuvers was to be flown at 5 feet or lower. (the lower the better)

Our Mirror Meet died from lack of participation. The Mirror Meet was the most difficult stunt pattern ever flown in a contest. The Mirror Meet maneuvers were submitted by George Aldrich, Lloyd Curtiss, Hi Johnson, Bob Palmer, Jim Saftig, and Don Still.
De Hill

Offline Sean McEntee

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #10 on: May 26, 2015, 09:38:38 PM »
   Hey De!

           Yeah that sure was a fun one. 

           Perhaps the VSC powers that be will add it to the event one year?   I think it would do good for the health of the event if they rotated some of the less serious events.  Keep OT, Classic/Super 70s and ignition, but annually rotate the "for fun" event, like the ringmaster event.  I mean, for crying out loud, the ringmaster gets its own contest!   I think a Mirror Meet event at VSC would be cool for a year or two, then switch it out with something else to keep things fresh.

Offline proparc

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #11 on: May 26, 2015, 09:42:43 PM »
I believe you are thinking of the beginner pattern, as it is usually flown.

 LL~ LL~ LL~ LL~
Milton "Proparc" Graham

Offline Russell Shaffer

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2015, 08:41:19 AM »
Just fly combat.
Russell Shaffer
Klamath Falls, Oregon
Just North of the California border

Offline FLOYD CARTER

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #13 on: May 27, 2015, 08:59:32 AM »
Perhaps adding a sub-set of more difficult maneuvers to only the PAMPA Expert class.  It would help the judging, because the top flyers all do so well it requires a very critical judge to spot imperfections in those flights.  At the expert level, contests are won by sometimes fractions of one point!  An additional level of complexity might spread out the scores in Expert.

Floyd (A retired Advanced flyer)
89 years, but still going (sort of)
AMA #796  SAM #188  LSF #020

Offline Bill Johnson

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #14 on: May 28, 2015, 08:04:07 AM »
I believe you are thinking of the beginner pattern, as it is usually flown.

Hey! I resemble that remark!
Best Regards,
Bill

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Offline Jim Kraft

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2015, 12:24:23 PM »
That 30' high max could be done with Bislobs. Or, Fox 35's only, and design your own plane to meet the demand. Thinking outside the box can be fun, but reality sets in and we still have to fly in the hemi. Sometimes my pattern looks like I am thinking outside the box when my brain says to my hand, "what were you thinking". LL~ LL~
Jim Kraft

Offline Randy Cuberly

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2015, 12:31:53 PM »
   Hey De!

           Yeah that sure was a fun one. 

           Perhaps the VSC powers that be will add it to the event one year?   I think it would do good for the health of the event if they rotated some of the less serious events.  Keep OT, Classic/Super 70s and ignition, but annually rotate the "for fun" event, like the ringmaster event.  I mean, for crying out loud, the ringmaster gets its own contest!   I think a Mirror Meet event at VSC would be cool for a year or two, then switch it out with something else to keep things fresh.

Oh My Gawd!!!!! 

Randy Cuberly
Randy Cuberly
Tucson, AZ

Offline Norm Faith Jr.

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #17 on: June 02, 2015, 11:43:27 PM »
I've always wondered about a vertical square eight.
Norm
Circlepilot   AMA9376

Offline Trostle

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Re: Free Style
« Reply #18 on: June 04, 2015, 05:14:42 PM »
I've always wondered about a vertical square eight.
Norm

Good airplanes can to it.  They can also do square four leaf clovers.

Keith


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