Bought a new (another) LA46. Feels a little different.

[Michael Massey]

Just bought another LA46.  Feels a little different, different instruction book, seems to run about the same on the bench.  I have not put it in a plane yet. 

I happened to notice "Made in China" on the box.  I checked and all of my other ones are made in Japan.  Hope this is not a bad omen.

[Douglas Ames]

Chinese O.S.? The Apocalypse is getting closer every day.
You would think the Japanese would have the tooling written off by now,
and assembly/ fitting after CNC can't cost that much labor!

Any pictures of the ports/ cyl.?
Is it still ABN?

[Randy Cuberly]

I just saw on the boob tube where China has now surpassed the US in Economic prosperity!  Our wonderful Government has deliberately allowed that to happen...Treasonous Bastards!

Randy Cuberly!

[Larry Wilks]

I bought a used LA46 at a recent swap meet.  The back plate says "Made In China" and it is metal not plastic.
I thought someone replaced the back plate with a China knock off version? Runs fine, just have to put it on a
plane for the real test. Larry

[bill bischoff]

Could be a backplate from a ThunderTiger GP 40...

[richardhfcl]

Gents,

     Isn't some of the Thunder Tiger engine production now on mainland China?  I seem to remember hearing

that somewhere, though I might have just imagined the notion.

     Best regards,

     Richard Ferrell

 

[Michael Massey]

Douglas,

Nothing in the instructions indicate whether it is ABN or not.  Neither does the older instructions from the Japanese engines.  Aside from the engine feeling a little different (by that I mean it feels very slightly more "rough" on the metal finish) it looks and acts the same as the older Japanese version.  I thought it might have slightly more compression but that may simply mean my others are getting older.  They do have a lot of run time.

The only real change I noted in the instructions is the fuel requirements.  They changed from 20% castor to 18% castor, synthetic or a mixture thereof.  Hard to tell if that indicates any real change in the motor itself.

But not to fret, the instructions are still very clear about not putting you hand in the prop or drinking the fuel.

[Bootlegger]

 For Rusty about the rooskie saying that the U S A would fall without a shot being fired, that was Krusthev (spelling?) back in the early 60's.

 And it appears that our own Guvt will be the culprit. I am with R Cuberly dirty bastards in Washington is why..!!

[Steve Helmick]

Mike...look in the exhaust port and see if the cylinder is chromed or nickled. If Chromed, you'll see brass on the outside of the sleeve. If nickel plated, it'll be 100% plated. Please report back!   Steve

[Michael Massey]

Hi Steve,

First, it is Mike, not Brian.  He is the older looking one.

As for the engine.  Forgive my lack of metallurgy prowess, but the sleeve (at the exhaust port) looks like a light brownish color.  Bear in mind I have bench run this for about 1 hour.  The piston looks shiny but not chrome.  Give me some more color "hints" and I will try to be more specific.  Also bare in mind my color perception has been defined by "competent" medical personnel as "defective."

[Akihiro Danjo]

OS is now manufacturing many engines in China with the same technique and quality in Japan.

Aki

[Scott Richlen]

What is most probably going on is the following:

Every OS product generates a revenue stream and if that stream is in decline the company needs to figure out how to restore it or they may drop the product.  I doubt that OS, like any well-run company, develops a lot of nostalgia for its products (other than "boy, that one used to make a lot of money for us!")  So, even though the specific manufacturing equipment has costed out, there are still fixed costs; for instance, the factory space could be used to make a more profitable product.  Since the revenue stream consists of sales number times profit on each engine, and the sales numbers are undoubtedly sagging, OS needs to figure out how to increase profit on each engine to maintain its revenue stream.  Otherwise, its by-by LA-46!  And it can't increase price to increase profit, so it has to reduce cost.

So, it's "off to China we go."  Here is the critical question: is it an OS plant in China with the QC being done by OS or has the LA-46 manufacture simply been contracted out?  The Chinese, in the past, have been known to low-ball a bid based on a profit losing product (i.e., they provided a much higher cost/quality product than represented in their bid) and then once they have the contract, cut costs (including quality) like mad in order to get back into the profit window.

So, the good news is that they are still making the LA-46.  The bad news is that it may not be a very good LA-46, or if it still is, may not be in the near future.

I suggest that one of you with a new, made in China LA-46 see if one of our engine guru's will take a look at it.  There really are only a handful of them (as opposed to the rest of us who all just have an opinion and a Dremel tool); I'd suggest Frank Burns, Randy Smith, or Frank Bowman.  That way, we'd know if the engine, as they are currently manufacturing it, is good.

If it turns out that it is still good, then you better buy one now rather than role the dice on "later."

Scott

[Jim Svitko]

I have been using the LA 46 for a few years.  I recently bought two more from Tower.  They came in boxes that said "made in China."  Neither has been run so I can't give any data on how they perform compared to those made in Japan.

I also have a new one in the box, never run, made in Japan.  In comparing this one to the Chinese versions, I can see no difference regarding visual inspection.  I only removed the heads to have a peek.  They are identical as far as I can tell.  If there is a difference, the Chinese version might have an external surface that is slightly rougher in some areas. 

The Japanese made version will have "Japan" on the left side of the case, between the gussets.  On the Chinese versions, I see no markings on the external surface to indicate where it was made.  But, my aging eyes might have missed something.

[Brian Massey]

Hi Steve,

First, it is Mike, not Brian.  He is the older looking one.

Only because of his failing eyes.

The Younger One

[Tim Wescott]

So, the good news is that they are still making the LA-46.  The bad news is that it may not be a very good LA-46, or if it still is, may not be in the near future.

Everything I know about this is second-hand, but some of it is a pretty close second hand:

You can get good quality out of a Chinese contract manufacturer, but you have to ride them.  At the very least you have to inspect what comes in the door, and be pretty draconian about not accepting schlock.  Better is to go and inspect the factory in person (and keep doing so at least once a year).  (I had a long conversation with a guy whose job it was to do this factory inspection for Pittmon Motors -- the end-point of a several-day inspection was getting to FINALLY see the knurling operation, which was a guy in a back alley, with an old lathe in the outdoors, under a tarp -- because everyone is a contract manufacturer).

So it's certainly not a done deal that the engines are going to turn to schlock.  But, it's not a done deal that they won't (not that it ever is -- I think Mr. OS is in his eighties, if he's even still with us).

And lest we get too prideful -- the Japanese ate our lunch in the 1970's because you couldn't get decent product out of the US.  So we're perfectly capable of turning out schlock right here, if we really want to.  It's just that at the moment, it'll be much more expensive schlock than can be had from China.

[Jim Svitko]

Everything I know about this is second-hand, but some of it is a pretty close second hand:

You can get good quality out of a Chinese contract manufacturer, but you have to ride them.  At the very least you have to inspect what comes in the door, and be pretty draconian about not accepting schlock.  Better is to go and inspect the factory in person (and keep doing so at least once a year).  (I had a long conversation with a guy whose job it was to do this factory inspection for Pittmon Motors -- the end-point of a several-day inspection was getting to FINALLY see the knurling operation, which was a guy in a back alley, with an old lathe in the outdoors, under a tarp -- because everyone is a contract manufacturer).

So it's certainly not a done deal that the engines are going to turn to schlock.  But, it's not a done deal that they won't (not that it ever is -- I think Mr. OS is in his eighties, if he's even still with us).

And lest we get too prideful -- the Japanese ate our lunch in the 1970's because you couldn't get decent product out of the US.  So we're perfectly capable of turning out schlock right here, if we really want to.  It's just that at the moment, it'll be much more expensive schlock than can be had from China.

I remember the "schlock" of the 1970s, mostly from the auto industry.  The Vega, which had an engine that was lucky to last 10,000 miles and a body that would rust out before that.  The Pinto (AKA Firebomb).  I am sure there were others but these two seem to be the most notorious.  I did not think worse cars could be made until the Yugo appeared.

[Steve Helmick]

I have no idea what the Massey brothers are talking about. I checked my post, and I clearly wrote "Mike".   

At least I can identify you by name in person...the one with the spicy brown mustard and hotdogs is Brian.  Steve

[Dennis Moritz]

The Fox site was ready to take my credit card. Dunno if that means they're functional. Pistols are being made in the USA. Some out the door for under $200. Reviews of these pistols positive. Quality good. Cheaper than Euro hand held bangers. Let's see, aluminum, forged steel, polymers, even chromed finishing. Close tolerances. A 2 stroke airplane toy engine shouldn't be more difficult to manufacture. Come to think of it. Ro-Jett makes a product. Machining barstock. That must take some time. Oh Wait. CNC machining. I guess the key for mass market (larger market) is make an RC engine to sell in quantity. Then reconfigure a few for CL. Are those chain saw engines converted to RC made in the USA?

[Dave_Trible]

When Supre Tiger went to China we all went oh c#Ąp! but actually the .51 and probably the .34 came out a better product.  The sleeves were so hard you couldn't hone them with regular equipment .  Couldn't hardly wear them out.  Maybe it's not so bad.  My thought is that China makes its own metals while Japan has to import.  Something happened though...don't think any Tigres or parts have come out for quite a while.  I also have a couple GMS engines that were Chinese made and well made.



Dave

[Brian Massey]

I have no idea what the Massey brothers are talking about. I checked my post, and I clearly wrote "Mike".   

At least I can identify you by name in person...the one with the spicy brown mustard and hotdogs is Brian.  Steve

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